Tradervic's Travesty

[ECOCKS]

I really feel bad for the guy, he obviously is still going through hell. Hope he can find the way out of this mess and most importantly learn from his mistakes. But it's not right of him to say that ALL FSU women are bad. many of us here are married to wonderful FSU ladies and I hope he can see how offensive that statement sounded. Maybe this is the reason some of the responces were a bit harsh?

Maybe that is part of it but I think more of it comes from the frustration of continually dealing with those who react to the "rules" and advice with the responses that they or their situations which are somehow "special" or "different". Ho hum, how many have we seen come and go? How many have stayed and contributed their stories and given us more information and larger wealth of knowledge?

Of course many of our relationships are special. Some of us have long-term reationships which, right or wrong, we believe to be special as well. Many more have a history of missteps, miscommunications, failures, what-have-you, that could provide valuable assistance.

[Spoon]

I really feel bad for the guy, he obviously is still going through hell. Hope he can find the way out of this mess and most importantly learn from his mistakes. But it's not right of him to say that ALL FSU women are bad. many of us here are married to wonderful FSU ladies and I hope he can see how offensive that statement sounded. Maybe this is the reason some of the responces were a bit harsh?

+1
Tradervic, I'm sure none of us would want to be in your situation, but your chance to end it swiftly has long since been and gone. You must realise though that there are men out there who are quite blissfully happy with married life to a FSU woman, many for several years. You can't tar all Ukrainian/Russian women with the same brush and not expect a reaction.

Good luck my friend, time to bite the bullet and file I'm afraid.....before you go insane and do something you'll really regret

[Daveman]

Tradervic,


When you post something like your original post which seemingly is a disparaging remark toward all FSU women, and with many men here married, engaged, or whatever to these women, AND when your story is a little on the darker side of strange in some ways -- of course you'll get a wide variety of comments.


I must confess that upon first read, I didn't believe it was a real story but more of a snow job for fun or something.  I'm still not so sure actually, but I'm giving the benefit of the doubt and accept it for what you say it is.  Thanks for sharing.


That being said.. let's flip this around a little.


If things were as strange as you say prior to the wedding..  what qualities in her, what basis did you have, etc, to think it would work out later?  If you would shed some light on these types of thoughts, perhaps you could persuade some other guy in a somewhat similar situation to reevaluate his situation as well as his options.


What exactly convinced you that there was a real chance that things would get better? Instead of "hindsight being 20-20".. think about it and go back to that time period in your mind.. what was your reasoning at the time?


Dave

[tradervic]

Admin will you please remove this thread?  The replies, comments and speculation made about my story has become very hostile.  I would appreciate it if you would please remove this thread completely, I'll simply reply to other members threads if I decide I have anything of value to add.  I can't believe some of the responses I've gotten to my story-I don't think I'll be participating in this forum any longer.  Thank you!

[tradervic]

Admin please remove this thread.  Thank you.

[tim 360]

tradervic,  why ever would you want this thread removed?  It's very instructive and lets the newcomer know what NOT to do and what the ramifications can be if one keeps making mistakes.  You get a miserable life.
 
You say you used to be a happy guy until you married this lady.  The warning signs (as you tell it) were clear, yet you put on rose colored glasses and hoped things would get better--and they didn't.
 
Thanks for your story.  FWIW:  Get away from this woman and get a divorce ASAP...you are not doing yourself any good.  Be a happy guy.
 
You did paint all FSU women with too broad of a brush--many are much better than your wife.  You chose unwisely.
 
 

[Daveman]

Admin will you please remove this thread?  The replies, comments and speculation made about my story has become very hostile.  I would appreciate it if you would please remove this thread completely, I'll simply reply to other members threads if I decide I have anything of value to add.  I can't believe some of the responses I've gotten to my story-I don't think I'll be participating in this forum any longer.  Thank you!

Hostile?  I disagree.  As far as the varied responses you received -- what exactly did you expect?  There are quite a number of very experienced members here, both male and female.  When a story sounds "unusual", it will be challenged. That's certainly not a bad thing. People here tend to honestly express what they think.  You should be used to that by now after so many years married to an FSUW. 


As to removing the thread... That doesn't happen here without very good justification to do so.  Once posted, your story becomes part of the public record.  Readers can draw their own conclusions as to what lessons to take from it. 


I regret that you feel unable to participate in this thread further.  I would really have like for you to answer the questions I posed to you because those would be the most beneficial answers in assisting others... 


Dave

[tfcrew]

Tradervic's Travesty

It certainly is an appropriate title.

[tradervic]

It certainly is an appropriate title.

"Injustice anywhere is a threat to justice everywhere"
~ Dr. Martin Luther King Jr.

"Absolute power corrupts absolutely"
 ~ Lord Acton

"The government has everything it takes to take everything you have."
 ~ TJ



I don't understand this response at all.  And why so many quotes about absolute power, injustice and the like?  Weird...

[tfcrew]

Vic..
You chose your own thread title.
I get to choose my own signature.
OK?

[tradervic]

Tradervic,


When you post something like your original post which seemingly is a disparaging remark toward all FSU women, and with many men here married, engaged, or whatever to these women, AND when your story is a little on the darker side of strange in some ways -- of course you'll get a wide variety of comments.


I must confess that upon first read, I didn't believe it was a real story but more of a snow job for fun or something.  I'm still not so sure actually, but I'm giving the benefit of the doubt and accept it for what you say it is.  Thanks for sharing.


That being said.. let's flip this around a little.


If things were as strange as you say prior to the wedding..  what qualities in her, what basis did you have, etc, to think it would work out later?  If you would shed some light on these types of thoughts, perhaps you could persuade some other guy in a somewhat similar situation to reevaluate his situation as well as his options.


What exactly convinced you that there was a real chance that things would get better? Instead of "hindsight being 20-20".. think about it and go back to that time period in your mind.. what was your reasoning at the time?


Dave

Per your request I'll try to answer your questions best I can.  Just so everyone knows my intentions in initially posting my story were only to try and help others, what is really weird to me is that so many people don't believe it, why not believe?  Bad things happen to people everyday. 

I apologize for grouping all Eastern European women together, I was wrong to do that, but I'm not kidding you when I say:  1)  my family physician told me he has had 5 patients that married women from either Russia or Ukraine and they did not work out.  2)  Part of the story I left out: our parish priest refused to marry us, we had a chaplain do it instead.  The priest said he refused to do it because these marriages never work out.  I stopped going to Mass after that for quite a while.  3)  My wife and her friends really do talk about their American husbands and what they are able to glean from them.  Why is this so surprising?  Anyone who is or was married to a Ukrainian woman know that these women expect their man to bring home the beans, that's the way it is in Ukraine, that's the way it is here.  Why else would they go to all the trouble to meet an American man?  Because of our charming personalities?  No, they want stability and security-so for me to say that they want a green card, etc is not unreasonable.  These women want a better life and who can blame them?

When Katrina and I met it was in Kiev, it was a warm summer night, we walked downtown arm in arm, the street vendors, musicians, people gathered together singing, it was so charming and romantic, same when we went to the Caribbean together, we were really in love so we got engaged.  To address your question directly, I thought, I hoped it might work out because we loved each other.  What I failed to take into account was the age factor, Katrina was a lot younger than me and still had a lot of growing up to do.  So that is the first thing you can learn from my situation, try to find  a girl as close to your age as you can.

Ukrainian women are the most beautiful women in the world, the Moors used to travel that far north and kidnap them and bring them back home they are/were so beautiful.  But be warned, the better looking and the younger she is, the more parenting you will have to do because they expect to be spoiled.

You asked what qualities Katrina possessed that made me think it might work out later.  None really, it was the qualities I had that made me think it would work out.  I'm very spiritual so I thought prayer would help.  I thought me being more patient with her would help.  And I didn't want to see her have to go back to a country where her future looked somewhat limited, I thought I could tough it out and make it work, but it didn't happen.  So another word of warning.  Check yourself first.  Are you up for the challenge?  It is a big responsibility taking care of one of these women.  They don't always hit the ground running when they get here, it takes them a while to adapt to our culture, learn the language, customs.  They aren't used to American men either, in Ukraine men aren't as sensitive, Ukrainian women are used to being cheated on and hurt by Ukrainian men  (Sorry I'm not generalizing but it happens a lot, maybe not 100% though okay so don't everybody attack me) so when they get here and see how nice American guys are, well its easier for them to take advantage of it if they want.

I never said this whole situation was not completely my fault, it certainly is, I was looking through rose colored glasses as you put it.  I hoped things would work out and I didn't want to see her have to go back to poverty so I just stuck to it best I could.  The takeaways are this:  1)  Try not to have too much of an age gap.  2)  The more beautiful and intelligent the more is expected of you.  3)  Can you do it?  Do you have what it takes to take care of another human being who may be totally dependent on you for a long time?  4)  Check yourself.  Don't live in fantasy land like I did hoping it will work out.  If its not working, get out of the marriage.

That's all I have to say, thanks for reading, sorry if I offended anyone and this will be my last post.  I'm not saying these marriages don't work 100% of the time, but they can get pretty messed up.  As for me, I plan on trying Brazil next.  I know a guy who married a girl from Brazil and she gave him a huge, happy wonderful family.  And she works too, brings tons of money into the household.  Plus they're not as cold (generally speaking, please people no attacks), Brazilian girls are fun loving, beautiful and family oriented.  So see you south of the border...I'm outta here!

[tradervic]

Vic..
You chose your own thread title.
I get to choose my own signature.
OK?

Sorry, my bad, I didn't know that was a signature...I though they were quotes aimed directly at me.  Apologies.

[ECOCKS]

The OP's last response says so much about why the guy needs to have his head in the right place before embarking on this path. This gal was lucky she didn't waste her youth on this relationship.

[tradervic]

The OP's last response says so much about why the guy needs to have his head in the right place before embarking on this path. This gal was lucky she didn't waste her youth on this relationship.

ECOCK?  Seriously?  That's your user name?   Bro, try to remember I was the one who got burned not her.  Oh and by the way, if you didn't read we've been in this marriage for eight years and it still going, so she did waste her youth on this relationship, and so  did I.  We're both still wasting it now.  Save your comments for the peanut gallery.  Nice avatar too.  1980 called and they want their militia men back.  Get a life.

[ECOCKS]

ECOCK?  Seriously?  That's your user name?   Bro, try to remember I was the one who got burned not her.  Oh and by the way, if you didn't read we've been in this marriage for eight years and it still going, so she did waste her youth on this relationship, and so  did I.  We're both still wasting it now.  Save your comments for the peanut gallery.  Nice avatar too.  1980 called and they want their militia men back.  Get a life.

LOL, learn to read sad sack.

She's not wasting it if she's gotten 8 years of support out of you.

Hope this gal got her citizenship while taking this guy.

Oh, how many last posts have you made in the last 24 hours?

[Daveman]

Vic..
You chose your own thread title.
I get to choose my own signature.
OK?

Actually, JFTR,  he didn't... this was split off from another TR and it was the only 66.6R % alliteration I could come up with at the time.   

[Jooky]

I apologize for grouping all Eastern European women together, I was wrong to do that...
 
These women want a better life and who can blame them?

The problems you've seen have nothing to with Eastern European women. They have everything to do with a very specific group of women that are willing to compromise what they seek in a partner in return for a 'better life'.
 
No doubt what your physician, priest and wife's friends reveal is true. That's because they are viewing only women from this specific group. I have several Russian friends that have come to live in the US through work or the diversity lottery and often when they meet Russians and Ukrainian women of this type here in the US they feel ashamed.
 
So don't blame culture, or even age difference. You sought out a woman who made a compromise in search of a better life. Warning: Seeking a woman in Brazil is not a solution. You will be tapping into the same type of desperation that led to your current disaster.

[Daveman]

Thanks for continuing the thread Tradervic... what you wrote speaks volumes for what guys should be aware of going into this.

The problems you've seen have nothing to with Eastern European women. They have everything to do with a very specific group of women that are willing to compromise what they seek in a partner in return for a 'better life'.
 
No doubt what your physician, priest and wife's friends reveal is true. That's because they are viewing only women from this specific group. I have several Russian friends that have come to live in the US through work or the diversity lottery and often when they meet Russians and Ukrainian women of this type here in the US they feel ashamed.
 
So don't blame culture, or even age difference. You sought out a woman who made a compromise in search of a better life. Warning: Seeking a woman in Brazil is not a solution. You will be tapping into the same type of desperation that led to your current disaster.

Yep, absolutely agree here.  Unfortunately, the ones from this group are also the ones front and center of those who are targeting a relationship/marriage with a foreigner which means they are generally the ones western men are exposed to the most through the 'easier' routes.


That doesn't mean every agency girl is the spawn of hell... just more of the seats are taken by them.

[tfcrew]

   Anyone who is or was married to a Ukrainian woman know that these women expect their man to bring home the beans, that's the way it is in Ukraine, Why else would they go to all the trouble to meet an American man?   These women want a better life and who can blame them? Ukrainian women are the most beautiful women in the world. 

Again, this is a broad brush/ blanket generalization. And those kind generally tend  to be wrong.

I am retired and disabled..my wife works full time at a grocery store to make the kind of money we can use to get all the extras that we have.
'The most beautiful' may come from just anywhere.

 

 
 

[Eduard]

I never said this whole situation was not completely my fault, it certainly is, I was looking through rose colored glasses as you put it.

Considering she was practically a child who wanted a better life and just didn't know any better, how can you blame this on her? Sure, her morals and ethics sound questionable, but again, who"s fault is it that you didn't bother to figure that out BEFORE you brought her over? And then once you saw the side of her personality that you didn't like you still married the girl?!?! It wasn't like you got her pregnant, why marry some one with questionable morals?

4)  Check yourself.  Don't live in fantasy land like I did hoping it will work out.  If its not working, get out of the marriage.

That's all I have to say, thanks for reading, sorry if I offended anyone and this will be my last post.  I'm not saying these marriages don't work 100% of the time, but they can get pretty messed up.  As for me, I plan on trying Brazil next.  I know a guy who married a girl from Brazil and she gave him a huge, happy wonderful family.  And she works too, brings tons of money into the household.  Plus they're not as cold (generally speaking, please people no attacks), Brazilian girls are fun loving, beautiful and family oriented.

You give a good advice in #4) BUT, it appears that you are not listening to your own advice. You know one guy who married a Brazilian woman whos marriage seems to have worked out well and now you are basing your new fantasy on that. I know many men who married FSU women who are very happy with them but now you are dismissing that reality and buying into a new fantasy of "family oriented, fun loving" Brazilian girls. I'm very concerned that you will slip into the same pattern of finding a young, economically disadvantaged pretty girl who would be a total mismatch for you and your story will repeat only now in Portugese...
I really do wish you well and hope very much that you take your own advice and don't repeat the same mistakes, now in Brazil.

[pitbull]

This tradervic guy (or gal) is totally a troll. Also went too heavy on the MOB marriage cliches. Clumsy work.

[GQBlues]

.......  3)  My wife and her friends really do talk about their American husbands and what they are able to glean from them.  Why is this so surprising?  Anyone who is or was married to a Ukrainian woman know that these women expect their man to bring home the beans, that's the way it is in Ukraine, that's the way it is here.....

 
Speaking of 'beans', you and an ex-member at the old board named 'Bean' can definitely enjoy more than a cold beer or two together and swap stories, TraderVic. Old members like Maxx knows who I'm talking about. Like you, he wasn't enamored with his experience about the MOB either. Unlike you however, I believe Bean married a woman closer to his age...
 
Anyway, Brazilians, Um, uummm! Good choice!
 
An aside, there was a show that came on cable not too long ago about how Venezuela is fast becoming the fake boobs capital of the world so much even Chavez is alarmed at the money their women are spending to get their boob jobs. LOL, FWIW....
 
Be a sport and stick around...

[Chelseaboy]

Tradervic,
                I'm sorry that your marriage didn't work out.
Whenever a man marries a much younger woman,he's taking a big risk,and it doesn't matter which nationality she is.The hotter she is,the bigger the risk.
I've been there,and it wasn't with a woman from the FSU.
Sometimes the risk was worth it,because both people are happy in the marriage,but most of the time things won't work out long-term.
It's the chance you take,when you marry a much younger woman,and you have to accept it.
We are what we are,and if your preference is for a hot young lady as a wife,well you know what floats your boat.
Don't make the mistake of assuming it will be any different with a young beauty from Brazil,just because she's not from Ukraine.It might be,but then again it might not.
If you're prepared to take that big risk again,then go for it.
Otherwise,take a pause for some serious thought,before you jump back in.

[Turboguy]

I thought your long post (# 60) was rather good.   There was a lot of truth in that.
 
I do think when it comes to FSU women there is nothing in the world that can compare to a good one and probably few women from anywhere who can be much worse than a bad one.
 
I am glad you have posted your story.  I am also sorry you received so much flack.  It does happen and just as you posted with the intent to help people those who were critical had the same motive as well as wanting to understand more of what happened.  I do hope you stick around.   
 
Good luck with the search for a Brazilian woman.  Personally, before I searched in Russia for a little while I contacted some South American women.  This was ages ago.  I also had a close friend who was Brazilian and met a few of his female Brazilian friends.  Brazilian women are fun loving I agree, Hedonistic would be the better term.  Frankly if I was interested in a Latino woman I would probably pick most any other country first, one where women are more interested in being a good wife but it is your choice.

[Faux Pas]

I thought your long post (# 60) was rather good.   There was a lot of truth in that.
 
I do think when it comes to FSU women there is nothing in the world that can compare to a good one and probably few women from anywhere who can be much worse than a bad one.
 
I am glad you have posted your story. I am also sorry you received so much flack.  It does happen and just as you posted with the intent to help people those who were critical had the same motive as well as wanting to understand more of what happened.  I do hope you stick around.   
 
Good luck with the search for a Brazilian woman.  Personally, before I searched in Russia for a little while I contacted some South American women.  This was ages ago.  I also had a close friend who was Brazilian and met a few of his female Brazilian friends.  Brazilian women are fun loving I agree, Hedonistic would be the better term.  Frankly if I was interested in a Latino woman I would probably pick most any other country first, one where women are more interested in being a good wife but it is your choice.

I have to agree with Pitbull. There is so much wrong here it is difficult to determine if this is even a real person much less a real story.


IMHO, tradervic has been extended a lot of latitude especially, given the incendiary nature of the opening post.


Take it another step farther, he/she is offering advice they have yet to take his/herself.


Stuck in a marriage from hell for 8 years, contemplating another two AND a Brazillian woman?


Methinks tradervic is pulling some chain looking for reaction. Trollish