Is this an unreasonable desire?

[Daveman]

So basically she will be on her own in the middle of nowhere in a strange country.
Sounds real caring.

Do not take it personal, I am just showing you a mirror of what happens when you look at one side of things. Aloe and her hubby have some issues, but to demonize him based on one side of the story is not what we should do here.
If we would read only what hubby has to say, we might advise him to send her back.
In either case the only two people who have the full picture are Aloe and her husband.

+1

I just read your wonderful news bleau. I am happy for you and your newly betrothed. I concur with everything shadow just posted and to you and I would also like to issue a bit of caution: You feel really good about your (1st trip I believe?) trip and everything went better than you could have dreamed. Your journey will start all over once she has arrived and in your home. Your Blue Ridge Mtn life sounds quite idyllic to you and I but, don't be surprised if she doesn't share that same enthusiasm. She has a whole different set of eyes and mindset than you. Until she actually does get assimilated , it can be a long row to hoe for you both. It's not all peaches and cream and it's never more "in your face" until it is reality. FWIW

And another +1


While I am personally awaiting the day where those dreams merge with reality, I can certainly add that, while a apt figure of speech,  FSUW have a tendency to express their, uh, let's say... 'thoughts'-- literally, "in your face" in a manner which many of us simply are not accustomed.  There is a bit of a different dynamic involved.

[Faux Pas]

+1




And another +1


While I am personally awaiting the day where those dreams merge with reality, I can certainly add that, while a apt figure of speech,  FSUW have a tendency to express their, uh, let's say... 'thoughts'-- literally, "in your face" in a manner which many of us simply are not accustomed.  There is a bit of a different dynamic involved.

Very true and misunderstandings and miscommunication are common and frequent, even when you "think" you understand each other. It is often that you don't. My wife has very good english skills but more often than not, a single word left out or misused completely changes the dynamic  of what you have said to one another.


A shot glass in the garbage disposal not once but twice was interesting 

[ML]

My wife has very good english skills but more often than not, a single word left out or misused completely changes the dynamic  of what you have said to one another.

More help with English homework last night.

Gal asked me to use 'make' in present form.

I said: "Please make me a sandwich.'

She said:  "Repeat, I don't understand."

So I repeated several times, and she said it was a rather strange sentence.

I said, "Why so strange."

She said:  "That the police would make you a sandwich."

That was good for a laugh for both of us regularly over the next 2 hours or so.

[Muzh]

So basically she will be on her own in the middle of nowhere in a strange country.
Sounds real caring.

Back to you Shadow. How do you know they did or didn't discuss this issue. What's that? Oh, assumptions? Hmm.
 

Do not take it personal, I am just showing you a mirror of what happens when you look at one side of things. Aloe and her hubby have some issues, but to demonize him based on one side of the story is not what we should do here.
If we would read only what hubby has to say, we might advise him to send her back.
In either case the only two people who have the full picture are Aloe and her husband.

 
Here's a cheval for you.
 
Aloe came here asking for opinions. If it sounds we are demonizing her hubby, that was part of the opinions asked by her.
 
You are telling us not to give her some opinions.
 
As for me, I gave her the benefit of my experience. As a grown woman, a little wet behind the ears tho, she will take our opinions for what they are.
 
When I was going through my divorce, I heard many opinions. Only I knew exactly what was going on. However, I was able to get different perspective that I would had never come to them in the state I was.
 
The only thing that you said that no one can refute is: In either case the only two people who have the full picture are Aloe and her husband.

Edit to add: 5 edits in less than 5 minutes. My grammar and spelling are horrible today.

[Shadow]

Back to you Shadow. How do you know they did or didn't discuss this issue. What's that? Oh, assumptions? Hmm.
 

As I mentioned it is called holding a mirror. The poster has a well tought out plan to provide what he feels is the best care for his fiancee. However his fiancee may think something entirely different without him knowing.

Here's a cheval for you.
 
Aloe came here asking for opinions. If it sounds we are demonizing her hubby, that was part of the opinions asked by her.
 
You are telling us not to give her some opinions.
 
As for me, I gave her the benefit of my experience. As a grown woman, a little wet behind the ears tho, she will take our opinions for what they are.
 
When I was going through my divorce, I heard many opinions. Only I knew exactly what was going on. However, I was able to get different perspective that I would had never come to them in the state I was.
 
The only thing that you said that no one can refute is: In either case the only two people who have the full picture are Aloe and her husband.

Edit to add: 5 edits in less than 5 minutes. My grammar and spelling are horrible today.

I encourage everyone to chime in with their opinions, and I agree with you that from what Aloe posts she is smart enough to make up her own mind.
But I do encourage everyone as well to think carefully before giving hubby certain classifications as he may have Aloes best interests at heart.

While I agree that some of his would warrant a negative opinion on the guy, at the same time like in the example above the other side could look totally different and show a guy who carefully plans the road to future full happiness.

[Boethius]

I agree with Shadow. 


Muzh, though I don't disagree with you, please also consider you were much older than Aloe, so had maturity and the scars of age/experience on your side.   Your relationship was also, I assume, not at the 2 1/2 year stage?


Aloe, there is no need to take a vacation to go somewhere quiet and think.  A forest near your home, or your bathtub, with an Ipod and "white noise" will produce the same effect.


As for letting go of the past, I think you do have to do this.  Don't bring up the past.  What you can do is say to him "When you do X (a similar type of behaviour, if it is pattern), I feel Y."

[Muzh]

I agree with Shadow. 


Muzh, though I don't disagree with you, please also consider you were much older than Aloe, so had maturity and the scars of age/experience on your side.   Your relationship was also, I assume, not at the 2 1/2 year stage?

Boe, I married my ex when she was 22. Two weeks before our second child's birthday, she (25)announce she found an apartment and moving out.
 
No, I was not Aloe's age. My ex was. I did however learned a lot about these dynamics. Not to mention that my parents divorced when I was 8.

Aloe, there is no need to take a vacation to go somewhere quiet and think.  A forest near your home, or your bathtub, with an Ipod and "white noise" will produce the same effect.


As for letting go of the past, I think you do have to do this.  Don't bring up the past.  What you can do is say to him "When you do X (a similar type of behaviour, if it is pattern), I feel Y."

Aloe, you listen to Boe here.

[BC]

Lots of good suggestions here.

All Aloe's posts here scream "I need attention"

It's not about the money.

It's not about this or that that he does, or does not do.

He comes home from work and plays games...  most games have options for multiple players...

It sounds as if someone, anyone needs to take the first step.

One of the questions a good psychologist will pose when a couple comes for counseling is "How is your sex life"..

It's actually a very good question.

Think basic needs....

Just IMHO.

[GQBlues]

Personally, I've held back telling Aloe anything definitive regarding their relationship simply because on the face of it, I can't get past how moronic some of the things she said her hubby does. I think that sentiment is fairly universal.
 
Which makes this just a tad bit sticky because I'm thinking how can then an otherwise bright, well-adjusted, personable young lady, as Aloe seem to be, actually *put up* and stay with a guy like him? Additionally, she would ocassionally inject nice things about him sounding as though he's the second coming...
 
Plus, reading some of her unrelated posts in the past, she doesn't strike me to be someone who's troubled, or even grieved, by the way she conducts her thoughts in many topics.
 
Dunno. Maybe I'm the clueless one when it deals with other people's relations...

[SANDRO43]

Gal asked me to use 'make' in present form.
I said: "Please make me a sandwich.'

That's not a present but an imperative form - you might confuse someone with a more solid grammar basis .

She said: "That the police would make you a sandwich."

Please/police ? Your accent also seems mildly confusing .

[bleau]

I apologize if I it sounded like I came on to strong with my post on this thread and I mean that with a lot of sincerity.
 
 Thanks Faux Pas for your words of wisdom concerning my fiance and how she will react here. We don't exactly live in the boonies and we live a little over one hour from an extremely large major southern city and  20 minutes from a town of 22,000.  She has seen videos of where her new home will be and even though the riff about most of the FSU girls are city girls and could or would not like living in a rual area I'm sure is experience talking from a lot of guys. I suggest waiting until my trips reports are completed and then anyone can make their own personal decision about this relationship and her new lifestyle over here. I'll tell you this much, shes extremely excited about living with the beauty of our mountains around her and getting away from the concrete and rush of big city life.

We also have about  6 FSU girls married and living in the same communities around us two for over 10 years. I know them all and they'll tell you...no way I want to live in a big city again. My Russian translator friend is originally from a very  large city, been here and married for about 12 years and she looks and acts the part...hiking boots, jeans, flannel shirts, will terrify anyone if they mess with her vegetable and flower gardens, drives a jeep, has two horses and four dogs and is very happily married and loves her life here.

And this is not my first experience being engaged to a Russian lady. I have been to Russia 12 times and I am not infatuated with my fiance and the hunt for a Russian wife or girl friend.

Cheers...daughter says I promised her a pizza tonight at the local pizza joint so I better get going or I could feel the wrath of a Russian daughter...not good from any daughter.
 

[Mike78]

Aloe, your "hubby" sounds like a real asshole AND kind of boring in addition to that...what a catch. What did initially draw you to him? IDK, unless something radical changes I don't see much of a future for you marriage...

[Mike78]

Aloe, your "hubby" sounds like a real asshole AND kind of boring in addition to that...what a catch. What did initially draw you to him? IDK, unless something radical changes I don't see much of a future for you marriage...

And this is coming from somebody who usually sides with the guy in relationship issues

[Boethius]

I think that is a little unfair, Mike.  We are, after all, only hearing one side of the story and even then, only very little, and only what Aloe chooses to disclose.   
 
 

[Aloe]

Thank you everyone for support and opinions.

Thanks Shadow, by the way we moved, now we are next to Leuven.

Aloe, there is no need to take a vacation to go somewhere quiet and think.  A forest near your home, or your bathtub, with an Ipod and "white noise" will produce the same effect.

There is almost no forest here, at least not a real one. A park maybe. Real forest is pretty far away. Everything is private property, you can only walk on the roads between the properties and crop fields. It is pretty damn depressing actually. I miss nature. Here everywhere you go it's endless FUGLY houses and crop fields, sometimes a pasture. A pasture is the most nature i've seen in the past 2 years, and a tiny little forest. I also miss HORRIBLY birds signing in the morning. It seems belgium is populated exclusively by pigeons.

Don't have a bathtub either, which is also normal around here.


Actually it is plenty quiet at home while hubby is gone. I'm just really indecisive and really really confused.

Lots of good suggestions here.

All Aloe's posts here scream "I need attention"

It's not about the money.

It's not about this or that that he does, or does not do.

He comes home from work and plays games...  most games have options for multiple players...

It sounds as if someone, anyone needs to take the first step.

One of the questions a good psychologist will pose when a couple comes for counseling is "How is your sex life"..

It's actually a very good question.

Think basic needs....

Just IMHO.

Completely unsatisfactoty  And it's not because he is bad or something, i just suddenly discovered tremendous appetites. I wasn't this way before we got married, that's for sure. So yeah, nothing he can do about it..

But you are very right. I do need attention. He comes home, we eat then it's immediately the TV or studying, and no time to talk at all. I can't get even 5 minutes talk. He stares down even the commercial. I ask all the time why do you watch commercial so attentively instead of talking to me, he just can't help it apparently. It is pretty difficult to get him distracted from tv, he can't wait even one minute without it, literally one minute. I used to say i wanna spend time together without tv on. He says, we spend time together all the time, while sleeping. Lol.

Personally, I've held back telling Aloe anything definitive regarding their relationship simply because on the face of it, I can't get past how moronic some of the things she said her hubby does. I think that sentiment is fairly universal.
 
Which makes this just a tad bit sticky because I'm thinking how can then an otherwise bright, well-adjusted, personable young lady, as Aloe seem to be, actually *put up* and stay with a guy like him? Additionally, she would ocassionally inject nice things about him sounding as though he's the second coming...
 
Plus, reading some of her unrelated posts in the past, she doesn't strike me to be someone who's troubled, or even grieved, by the way she conducts her thoughts in many topics.
 
Dunno. Maybe I'm the clueless one when it deals with other people's relations...

Thanks.

He does make me laugh all the time, and he is very pretty. And we are pretty good friends. That's what struck me the other day. We were friends online a long time before we met, then we got married, and now it seems we are back to being friends. I am afraid i feel towards him as a friend more than husband lately. I used to tell him during our first year of marriage that i would appreciate romantic gestures and stuff, but he just won't do it. It seems his belief is that if relationship takes an effort, then it is not a very good relationship. Hell, in our first year he would claim to me that it is awful that we argue, and when i'd say that all normal couples argue and that it's a sign of a healthy relatnioship, he would say that a good couple doesn't argue. Lol. So yeah, romantic gestures are out of the question, most likely. Before we were married he didn't make any romantic gestures either. 

[Boethius]

On romantic gestures, you aren't going to change him, and honestly, it is immature and silly.  I know lots of women who married "romantic" men and regret it, for a variety of reasons.


Arguing is not necessarily the sign of a good relationship.  What is a good sign is that when you have conflict, it is resolved.  The problem, from what you have posted, is that in your relationship, conflict is not resolved.  Your husband either is just avoiding it, or he is not validating your feelings (i.e., taking you seriously).


You were long distance friends, Aloe, correct?  Really, when you married, you didn't know this young man, nor he you.  If you really look back, did you marry him primarily because of physical attraction, without knowing the soul that inhabited that "pretty" body?


From your posts, it appears your husband is not one to want change - that is okay.  But what is not okay is for a 28 year old man to plunk himself in front of a tv all night.  It sounds as if he has no interests - does he read, is he interested in politics, sports, spirituality, etc.?  What are your interests, and do they intersect at all?  To be happily married long term, you need someone who nurtures or stimulates you somehow.  It sounds as if this is not happening, and that may be part of the reason for your unhappiness.


ETA - On the tanning, it is absolutely wrong of your husband to "force" you to tan, and if that is the case, you should refuse.  Aside from the fact I think this is abusive, tanning ages the skin and is a cause of cancer.  If anything, you should wear sunblock on your face, at least, so that it remains wrinkle free as long as possible.

[Shadow]

Thank you everyone for support and opinions.

Thanks Shadow, by the way we moved, now we are next to Leuven.

As I live near Ham, that is still 40 minutes. 

Regarding nature, I wonder if you are missing something. We do have various birds singing, including red robins, and in our garden we have spotted rabbits, chickens (both from some neighbour) a lively population of cats that we are researching the family tree of, hedgehogs, squirrells and bats. Also if anyone is missing bees, they should check near our hedge. So you might do a little garden spotting and find that there is much more than you imagine at first glance.

The similar thing is with your hubby. He is now at the point where he takes you for granted, and that includes the occasional cute outburst. As it seems the romantic in the relationship has always been you, so that means you will have to continue that.  As with many men (myself included) we feel that the hit on the head with the club and dragging you to our cave was all the romance you need.
The friendship is what you will need, as romance will come and go.  You married a guy who has got a pretty big shell around him, and from what I read that does come partially from his youth. You have already cracked the shell, and saw a great guy inside. Your job now, as hard as it is, is to crack and remove the shell further.
And btw babies may help. Not only to keep you busy (I know fisrt hand what a lot of work two guys are) but also because it will be something that he can not deny having to care for and interact with. Whenever he will take some time to take them off your hand (so you can cook his breakfast or dinner) you will enjoy to see him interacting.

[GQBlues]

...But you are very right. I do need attention. He comes home, we eat then it's immediately the TV or studying, and no time to talk at all. I can't get even 5 minutes talk. He stares down even the commercial. I ask all the time why do you watch commercial so attentively instead of talking to me, he just can't help it apparently. It is pretty difficult to get him distracted from tv, he can't wait even one minute without it, literally one minute. I used to say i wanna spend time together without tv on. He says, we spend time together all the time, while sleeping. Lol.....

Aloe-
 
I'll just share a perspective based on my personal experience with wifey. To me, there's a slice of truth with the phrase 'familiarity breeds contempt'. The first 2 years of my wife coming to marry and live with me, I was deliriously dying for some 'alone' time right around the 15-16th month. It wasn't because I didn't 'love' her or enjoyed her company, or repulsed of being attentive of her companionship, it was simply because I flat-out wanted to do something 'different' and get out and breathe a different air for a change. I was getting suffocated.
 
Now mind you, my life before and after my wife were worlds apart in terms of my life's time management. I went from literally doing anything at anytime with anyone or none - to being with my wife, morning, noon and night. If it wasn't for some momentary respite  brought about by some of my friends who had taken their time to befriend my wife and spent time without me - I don't think I could've lasted as long as I have so far. This may well be subjective, so please, I am not trying to convince you of anything or go and do anything.
 
I have literally been independent all my life and had taken advantage of my adventurous life far more than my share, then all of the sudden crossed that line in a blink of an eye and live a life so opposite than before. I credit my wife for understanding that. Many of our arguments/fights before were likely borne more of my personal crisis than hers.
 
Fast-forward to today, the past year had been excruciating for both me and wifey in terms of spending quality time toegther. Earlier this year, she decided to switch career course and got into accounting, Wifey is so bright she excels in almost everything she takes her time to do. Got a great position in a great company and she's climbed a few ladder steps inside of the year. Around April, she took the next inevitable step and started to take the CPA exam. Folks will tel you how zany and crazy this experience is. it's a 4-part examination...long story short, between her job (there's time where she works 10-12 hrs/day, 7 days/wk during their 'busy period: April/Septmeber-October), coupled with her studying for the exam on top of it, she barely have time to eat much less cuddle up with me like we used to do. Yeah, from my part, I give her as much time as she needs. On top of working and posting on RWD, I clean the house, shop, cook, pack her lunches, do our laundries, play golf, scrub the floors, clean the bathrooms, pay the bills, play golf, care for the cats, mind the garden, etc...stuff normal hubbies would do during these times.
 
It's trying not to have the same 'romantic' times we used to have, but life goes on, and at this time because of where we are in our marriage, there are things that need attending. So one step at a time. At this present time, wifey is in an exam room taking her 4th and final exam to earn full certification. Bright that she is, she aced the first 3 exams with whatever little time she had to study for them. So far, it's been worth our sacrifices. Romance never left. It just had to be put on-hold.
 
Bottom line suggestion for you, take a little personal air time. Give hubby and yourself some away time from each other. Not just time away while working or going to school, but establishing some friendships outside of your marriage you can spend time with that doesn't necessarily include hubby, and he for himself as well..
 
Thats my only suggestion for your current situation.
 
edited for clarification: I just read my post and just want to be certain, I am suggesting doing some other activity/ies with other people/friends outside of hubby - not have sex outside of marriage (lol). Just wanted to make sure...
 
 

[Misha]

he would say that a good couple doesn't argue. Lol.

If he defines his father's relationship with his gf as good, then yes a "good" couple does not argue 

So yeah, romantic gestures are out of the question, most likely. Before we were married he didn't make any romantic gestures either. 

Methinks that you married a man expecting that he would change after marriage The odds are quite remote that he ever will...

[Shadow]

Women marry man hopingthey will change.
Men marry women hoping they will not change.

[Muzh]

I'm sorry but too many changes of direction and my nose is picking up some smell.
 
Not even buying the confused state.

[Steamer]

Arguing is not necessarily the sign of a good relationship.  What is a good sign is that when you have conflict, it is resolved.  The problem, from what you have posted, is that in your relationship, conflict is not resolved.  Your husband either is just avoiding it, or he is not validating your feelings (i.e., taking you seriously).

Very true but arguing is the first step in bringing disagreements into the open, even if it is not resolved. Otherwise suppressed anger can eat at a relationship like acid.

[Gator]

On romantic gestures, you aren't going to change him, and honestly, it is immature and silly.  I know lots of women who married "romantic" men and regret it, for a variety of reasons.

Boethius, you are in a very small minority.  In fact, I do not know one woman who does not appreciate romantic notions. 


Telling her how beautiful she looks, stroking her hair gently while she is at the kitchen sink, a gift of flowers when there is no holiday or occasion, catching her doing something you like and telling her that she is the most wonderful woman in the world, reaching out and holding her hand, buying your woman a pretty dress, caressing her gently when sex is not on your mind, expressing in sweet words that you love her.....  Women like these acts and I enjoy doing them. 


I learned this early.  My first wife on our first Christmas explained to me that my gift of tableware (we needed it and we were poor) is not personal, and she wanted personal.  And she was an attorney.

[Gator]

Aloe,


The more you post the greater the divide between you and hubby.


Do your best to try and reach this man.   If you can not reconcile, don't continue to live the way you have.  I gather from your comments about having few friends that you are somewhat shy.  If so, leaving your man will not be easy.  Find the strength.


You are responsible for your own happiness. 

[Boethius]

Muzh, I think this is jumping due to uncertainty/emotion, and the nature of message boards.


Steamer, I don't think we're disagreeing.

Boethius, you are in a very small minority.  In fact, I do not know one woman who does not appreciate romantic notions. 

I'm not saying women do not appreciate romantic gestures.  But if a man is not romantic, asking him to change is futile.  Of course women appreciate romantic gestures.  My point was, if this is not who he is, appreciate him for who he is, and remember, when you look at another man who does do these things, his partner's life is not necessarily a bed of roses, so to speak.

You are responsible for your own happiness.

Very true.