Does a RW need to speak good English, I think not.

[Bruno]

Bruno, you said you thought I had a lot of unusual ways and risks.  You made me curious about that.  To me I am not doing things that much different than others.

Turbo, i was not speaking about the method or tool used... Tour, agency, newspaper or other thing are tools... Write one or more, visit one or more are method... each have advantage and problem...

It was more related to the language problem, specialy when i remember the K1 problem with Luda... at the interview, she was not able to give some basic information ( like your address if i good remember )... so problem is appear because of a lack of communication between the both of you, maybe because of language problem...

You seem to be a guy with enough "free" time and enough money... but a guy like me cannot make like you... when i make my proposal ( before the K1 ), i need to be almost sure that it is the right lady... i have not the time to visit the FSU almost each month for "test" women... a heavy selection need to be make before the first visit... if i have follow the same way that you, i need a lifetime for find the right woman since i have not your money and your free time...

I don't critic your way, it is your choice... but you can certainly admit that not everybody can follow your path... in reality, everybody need to seek his own way... and it is why i am sometime mad on these who use the clue bat for say that the method used by other is wrong... i know what is good for me but it is virtually impossible to know what is good for other... normally, so forum is about sharing experience, not try to impose our methode to other...

[Turboguy]

Before I start I will say that I just posted a separate poll on the subject.    For all this bickering my vote is going in the second category which is probably right next to the one some of the more concerned people will likely vote for.

I may start another poll about how long you have been searching.  That could be interesting.

Bruno, back when I started this persuit money and time were both more of an issue and there was no Internet and it was very difficult to set up meetings with the long time lag of snail mail.  Right now I can pretty much go as much as I want.  Actually I just had to cancel a trip and should be in Rostov making my 5th visit with the gal there right now.  Just for the record I ended up in the hospital instead of on the plane but I am fine now.

Luda and I had communication problems, but not from Language.  Once we found we could write notes to each other and understand each other it was easy to communicate if she would tell me what she was thinking.   Towards the end of her stay she could communicate orally very well.  We would resort to the notes for very complicated subjects. 

Personally I think if someone came her with no English they could just get on Translate Ru and write notes to each other until she got proficient in English.  Most of those gals are a lot smarter than some of us guys and I think for the most part they pick it up pretty quick when they are immersed in it.

Truthfully Bruno, and I am not meaning this as negative but my biggest disappointments have been when I was sure I had found my gal before meeting her.  I don't think I will do that again, but I did say that before the last time it happened too.

[Jet]

LMAO! 

What do the German lads do when they meet an FSU W who speaks only a little English and no German?

They'd speak English with her, of course. I've  met a WHOLE LOT of Germans all over Germany (and Austria) and have yet to run across one that spoke English on less than a 3.5/5 level.

All I can think is that you might be a wee bit jealous, KC? Something that you could not have for yourself?

C'mon PeeWee, how jealous do you think he could possibly be? ???

[Turboguy]

Heck, makes me jealous.  I don't even have a dog to keep me company.

[KenC]

My suggestion that I think would help you in your life and to help RWD is that you go out and beat your dog to get all this out of your system and come back when you can post something constructive. Now I think some of us want to get back to posting things that might help people.

That's my fear, Turbo, that someone would actually listen to your tripe!  That's why I will add this disclaimer when I quote you:
The above stated opinion or advice comes from a man that has spent tens of thousands of dollars and over ten years chasing women in the FSU that were too young, too uninterested in me or just plain scammers. My methods have resulted in absolutely nothing but loss of income and time.  Follow me at your own risk.
KenC

[Bruce]

TG - I suggest you listen to the majority of still married to FSU guys above.  I know that in my case I "failed" to find a marriage material girl until I decided to concentrate on / favor girls I could communicate well with in my native language.  I learned Russian for five years with a private native instructor all through the time I was visiting and sometimes working in Russia.  I could and still can easily make myself understood well in Russian.  My problem always was and still is understanding not only details but often anything in the Russian language.  Yes, I can understand simple things, get around no problem etc.  However, when it comes to intimate personal conversation as well as goals, aspirations and the most important devil in the details kind of conversation related to marriage I needed a girl very fluent in English.  So, I luckily was smart enough to find an interpreter / English teacher.  Now, I know the odds of a guy finding / falling in love with an interpreter are slim.  So, for the average guy I have to recommend that you find a girl who at least is good at learning languages / had alot of English previously in school and or can communicate the basics in English.  That way you can both initially be attracted to each other physically and then with time and alot of effort on her part (it is alot easier for Russian speakers to learn English) plus time and hopefully some more visits on your part realistically determine if the two of you could honestly do a K-1 visa.

[Turboguy]

Ken, you are making me feel real bad.  The worst of course was jet.  I went and suggested that you should go out and beat your dog to get rid of some of your frustrations and then Jet posts a photo of your wife and your dog and now I have to live with images of that poor little dog wimpering in pain.

As far as the subject at hand, my feelings on it are leading the poll right now.  If anyone listens to what I say, at the momement at least more people agree with me than disagree.  I don't mean to poll to vinicate me.  I just thought it was very hard to know how people really felt about the subject from this thread and I think the poll is showing much more.

I still think you should go back to trying to post something constructive Ken.  You have too much knowlege to waste it on petty tantrums.   I suggest if you feel you need to continue this either do it through PM's or go down to NHB and start a thread, Turboguy is an idiot or something like that.

Ken, I for one think RWD is about helping people.  I am not putting you on ignore but I am going to do the best to ignore the remarks and let people talk about constructive things.  I hope you either use a PM or got to NHB if you want to continue this.

[Turboguy]

Hi Bruce,

Good post.  You make your point well.  I have pretty much been doing that Bruce.  I won't totally rule out a gal with no english skills but I have been concentrating on the ones that speak English.   I have generally found it hard to really develop raport with someone who has no Enlish.  I was supposed to be on the tail end of a trip to meet around 8 gals, 6 of which spoke fluent english.  I have a feeling the other two would not have gone far because of the language. 

My next trip will be one of Jack's tours and I am trying now to sort through the ladies I would like to meet and English is one of the things I am looking at.   I am not insisting on excellent English but I want to go for at least some ability to communicate without an interpreter.

[PeeWee]

Hi Bruce,

Good post.  You make your point well.  I have pretty much been doing that Bruce.  I won't totally rule out a gal with no english skills but I have been concentrating on the ones that speak English.   I have generally found it hard to really develop raport with someone who has no Enlish.  I was supposed to be on the tail end of a trip to meet around 8 gals, 6 of which spoke fluent english.  I have a feeling the other two would not have gone far because of the language. 

My next trip will be one of Jack's tours and I am trying now to sort through the ladies I would like to meet and English is one of the things I am looking at.   I am not insisting on excellent English but I want to go for at least some ability to communicate without an interpreter.

 I was thinking of a tour so I will be interested in hearing your accessment of the trip. Jack Bragg is in Ukraine? If so then I won't do his tour. I am limiting myself to Russia and maybe the Scandinavian countries, still up in the air about that one but I keep thinking of that SAS hostess that I would see everyday as I transited in and out of Copenhagen a few years back. A common language is essential, in my opinion.

Peewee

[PeeWee]

LMAO!  :DThey'd speak English with her, of course. I've  met a WHOLE LOT of Germans all over Germany (and Austria) and have yet to run across one that spoke English on less than a 3.5/5 level.C'mon PeeWee, how jealous do you think he could possibly be? ???

Well you never know if one is happy in the marriage or not. Just because a woman is attractive does not mean that she is easy to live with. I noticed that Brad Pitt traded Jennifer in for a better model. Or so he thought. So what I ment was that he might be a little envious of the guys who are living the single life for all that it is worth.

I asked about the German because I have run across two of them of late who were very weak on the English skills. With only them as a comparison I had nothing to compare with. I had assumed that all Germans spoke English, until I ran into those two lads.

Peewee

[Turboguy]

This go round on tours Jack is just doing Ukraine.  I think in the past he has done Russia and perhaps the next time he will.   I would recommend staying away from the big agency tours but I think I am not telling you anything you don't know.  I will try and post something about how it goes.  I am taking my son along.  He has had bad luck with women so I thought maybe this could change his luck.

The impression I have is that Germans who speak English are very common.  I am sure there are many who don't though. 

A agree with you that just because a gal is beautiful does not mean they guy is happy.  Probably one of the prettiest gals I dated was the 21 year old wacko from New Jersey when I was 45.  I can tell horror stories about her for hours. 

[Jet]

Well you never know if one is happy in the marriage or not. Just because a woman is attractive does not mean that she is easy to live with. I noticed that Brad Pitt traded Jennifer in for a better model. Or so he thought. So what I ment was that he might be a little envious of the guys who are living the single life for all that it is worth.

Perhaps that would be a valid argument, had it not been immediately preceded by

..Peewee gives up nothing when it comes to women and beauty

FWIW, I'm not anywhere near as close to Ken and his wife as I am to several others cruising the frum circuit, but I've never seen ANY indication that they are anything less than happy together (nor has anyone who IS close with them ever rumored anything to that effect off board).

I think the primary aversion to KenC (and jb, and Leslie, and Andrew, and Helen, and some of the others) is that they are more blunt than you're accustomed to, but a good deal of the time, they are just the first to say what the rest of the married guys are thinking. If y'all weren't so busy being all indignamt and pissed off, you might actually be able to start to put the pieces together as far as what it actually takes to see this quest through to fruition.

[Turboguy]

I have to agree, I have never seen any indication that Ken and his bride are not happy.  I think we just made the statement that because you have a beautiful wife does not necessarily mean you have a happy marriage. 

I must have missed the part where Peewee and I were pissed off and indignant.  I was never pissed off and sure was not trying to be indignant.  I can't say I saw anything in PeeWee's post to think he was either.   I don't think we were the ones making comments that were spiteful and not pertaining to something constructive to the topic.  I really don't feel like talking about this more.  I really think it would be good to end the bickering and talk about constructive things.

My attitude on the language thing is the same as yours.   That being the case Ken must think you are an idiot and a looser too.  Personally I think you can be blunt too but you do it in a direct and constructive way and I think that is a good thing for all involved.  Read Ken's posts again Jet and tell me that ours are the pissed and indignant ones.  His were nothing but a temper tantrum with no relevance to anything.

As far as PeeWee dating beautiful women that is his business and most likely true.  I date a lot of ugly ones myself.  That is my business.

[KenC]

Jet,
Give it up because you can't win with these guys.  It's like quick sand, the more you struggle to free yourself, the more you sink in it.  And forget about any use of logic too.  If you are debating the weather, they will come back with "it can't be true because it is Tuesday!"  Or some other equally illogical or unrelated fact.  If you reread the posts, no where do I say that it is impossible to have a successful relationship with a woman that doesn't speak good English when you first meet. 
My whole point was that it was a major obstacle and with Turbo's miserable track record of one failure after another, that maybe, just maybe he should look for easier ways to accomplish his goals and quit using the high risk low reward methods of his past.  Of course he didn't hear any of that, and assumed that I disagreed with him about the language thing.  Turbo has a unique ability to sidestep the real issues and to hyperfocus on the ones that matter little.  How else can someone pathetically fail at this for ten friggen years?  You have to be talented enough to use every bad trick in the book.  Even a blind squirrel finds a nut now and then, but not Turbo.

As for Peewee (I bet that nickname gets 'em wet!) he has written books, but no one has ever seen them, dated beauty Queens that no one can substantiate and has had some mysterious love affairs with unknown women.  And he has the balls to come here and think I am jealous of his fantasy world?  Thank you for setting him straight with the photo of my wife BTW.  And of course his next attack is "but are they happy?"  Never mind that no one has seen the books, the beauty Queen etc etc.  The day I think I have to justify the happiness of the relationship I have with my wife to the likes of Peewee, is the day I shoot myself!

I really am not offended by any of the antics for this "Laurel & Hardy" act these two clowns seem to have mastered, but I have to say that Turbo's insinuation that he "helps" people here while I don't, does piss me off a bit.  He just doesn't ever seem to understand that advice from a total foolish failure as he is, just isn't valuable.  A normal guy doesn't want to spend tens of thousands of dollars and ten years of his life only to find himself old, pathetic and still alone.
KenC

[Turboguy]

Jet,
Give it up because you can't win with these guys.
That is the best suggestion you have had for a while Ken

Even a blind squirrel finds a nut now and then, but not Turbo.
Now you are definitely wrong.  I have found my share of nuts.

Turbo's insinuation that he "helps" people here while I don't, does piss me off a bit. 
I never said you didn't help people here.  I said your posts at the tail end of this thread were helping no one.  You were just spitting out angry dribble.  Lets both try to get back to a more positive position.

One other thing, the whole way through this thread you guys have been putting words in my mouth that never came out of it.   Perhaps if some of you had taken the time to read what I wrote before you said I believed something else this thread would not have gotten so blown out of proportion.   I see more posts that seem to indicate I advocate deliberately searching for a girl with no English and that I think it raises the chance of success.  I never said that and I don't believe that.  On the one to 10 scale on the poll my feelings are around a 7 or 8.  Proably not that much differant than most of you and the category that seemed to agree with most of the RWD people who voted.

[Bruno]

So, I luckily was smart enough to find an interpreter / English teacher.  Now, I know the odds of a guy finding / falling in love with an interpreter are slim.

I think that the odds are on my side and i feel myself very lucky...

A interpreter ( Russian - Ukrainian - German - English ) have find me  ... She have read my post on antidate and here at RWD and find me interesting...

And now, i can say that a common language ( she is better that me with english  ) help a lot... It allow a win of time in the building of the relationship... Week-end chat ( with skype ), from midnight until 04-05 hours in the morning have allow us to know each other very good... in one year, i have know better my actual girlfriend that i have know my ex-wife during the 6 year together ( 1 year dating and 5 year married )...

Of course, language is only one parameter... if she was a Ukrainian bitch speaking english, i was not with her now... language have allow me to discover the value of my girlfriend in a short time...

I asked about the German because I have run across two of them of late who were very weak on the English skills. With only them as a comparison I had nothing to compare with. I had assumed that all Germans spoke English, until I ran into those two lads.

The big majority of european have some base of english... specialy the younger people... only French people who are enough egocentric have a low level in foreign language...

Some older RW have language knowledge in French or/and German... These two language was teach in Russian school...

In some way, i find funny that American men speak about language skill from foreign women since in the big majority, American have a very low level, almost zero, in foreign language...

[wiz]

Turbo

Can I ask you what type of job you do?

The only reason for asking is that I have noticed that you post in nearly every thread on this board and I wonder how much free time you have?

[Turboguy]

Yes, you may Wiz.   I will even give you more information than you asked for.  I own a small manufacturing business.   My definition of small is about 15-20 employees depending on the time of the year.   We make landscape equipment.   I don't get very involved with the day to day operations.  I have people who run both production and the office and I concentrate on the advertising aspect and design our print ad's our brocures and our websites (6 of them).  I also design our new products.   I also man our booth at a lot of the trade shows we do which are all over the country.  Most of the time I am in the office and when I am doing something like a print ad, I like to take breaks and get away from it so I can have a fresher eye when I come back so I have lots of time to spend on RWD.

[Turboguy]

We talked earlier in this thread about a poll on the subject of how long you had been in your search for an FSU women.  Since so many guys had great input on the poll I posted about language, I would like to pick your brains before I post the pool this time. 

My thoughts were to have two categories within the post.  One for guys like me who are still looking, and one for guys who have found their girl and are either married or involved in the K-1 process.    I am thinking along these lines.

I have just started and have not even met an FSU woman yet.
I have been looking for less than 2 years and am still in the looking category.
I have been looking for 2-5 years and have not found my wife yet.
I have been looking for  6-10 years and have not found her.
More than 10 years  (I have a feeling I will be the lone guy in this one)
I am married or engaged and it took me less than 2 years to find her.
I am married or engaged and it took me 2-5 years to find her.
I am married or engaged and it too, me over 6 years of searching to find her.
I am married and met her without really looking for an FSU woman

Any suggestions or comments.  If these seems like it would not provide anything worthwhile just let me know and if that is the general conscensus I will just drop the idea.

[Jet]

I think you'll probably be surprised at how many votes fall into the very last catagory 

[Turboguy]

I think a lot of people may be surprised but I have heard enough individual stories that I knew it was going to be a popular selection.  Thanks for the comment.

[Bruno]

My thoughts were to have two categories within the post.  One for guys like me who are still looking, and one for guys who have found their girl and are either married or involved in the K-1 process.

Add one more categorie... the guys who have look, who have marry, who have divorce and who are looking again  ...

More than 10 years  (I have a feeling I will be the lone guy in this one)

Don't worry, i am with you... i have start my quest in 1996... find a RW in 1997... marry in 1999... divorced in 2004... seeking again in 2005-2006... i hope married to a UW in 2007... so, it will be 11 year...

But why limit to the FSU women... since these pool was inspired by one of my post where i speak about the quest for a wife... and it was related to success... A guy who have start seek a wife at 40 year old and who is married at 50 year old is certainly more successful that one who have use one year for find his bride but who have already a history of 10 divorce...

Maybe you can make something like this :

Time frame for the happiness quest ( from the first time you have seek a wife [local or foreign]  until marriage or now ) :

* Already married/widow [widow are not responsible of the fact that they are alone now, except in case of murder  ]
- 1 year
- 2 year
- 5 year
- 10 year
- 15 year
- 20 year
- 25 year
- more

* Always seeking/divorced
- 1 year
- 2 year
- 5 year
- 10 year
- 15 year
- 20 year
- 25 year
- more
! ! ! For the gay seeking russian men... sorry but these forum is RWD... the W mean Women   

[Son of Clyde]

I am married and it took me less than 2 years to find her.

Yes, there have been some problems and I don't think two or three more visits would change someone's lifelong personality. There are some things that are female and not "Russian" female personality traits.

You learn to live with them if you see she has many other qualities that shine through.

[PeeWee]

Yes, you may Wiz.   I will even give you more information than you asked for.  I own a small manufacturing business.   My definition of small is about 15-20 employees depending on the time of the year.   We make landscape equipment.   I don't get very involved with the day to day operations.  I have people who run both production and the office and I concentrate on the advertising aspect and design our print ad's our brocures and our websites (6 of them).  I also design our new products.   I also man our booth at a lot of the trade shows we do which are all over the country.  Most of the time I am in the office and when I am doing something like a print ad, I like to take breaks and get away from it so I can have a fresher eye when I come back so I have lots of time to spend on RWD.

 

Next time on the West Coast maybe let me know about, Turbodude.

Peewee

[PeeWee]

We talked earlier in this thread about a poll on the subject of how long you had been in your search for an FSU women.  Since so many guys had great input on the poll I posted about language, I would like to pick your brains before I post the pool this time. 

My thoughts were to have two categories within the post.  One for guys like me who are still looking, and one for guys who have found their girl and are either married or involved in the K-1 process.    I am thinking along these lines.

I have just started and have not even met an FSU woman yet.
I have been looking for less than 2 years and am still in the looking category.
I have been looking for 2-5 years and have not found my wife yet.
I have been looking for  6-10 years and have not found her.
More than 10 years  (I have a feeling I will be the lone guy in this one)
I am married or engaged and it took me less than 2 years to find her.
I am married or engaged and it took me 2-5 years to find her.
I am married or engaged and it too, me over 6 years of searching to find her.
I am married and met her without really looking for an FSU woman

Any suggestions or comments.  If these seems like it would not provide anything worthwhile just let me know and if that is the general conscensus I will just drop the idea.

Yes, i have one suggestion. Don't forget your 8s this time. The poll is a good idea. It gives a sense of were we are in relationship to all others with like minds. With regard to the married poll, do you think that it is implied that the search was an overall search or does the suggest suggest that the seach was specific to the one he married and excludes the misfires previous to him finding her?

Peewee