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Author Topic: Is there anyway to find out if Ukrainian documents issued for my young son ?  (Read 3412 times)

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Offline Boethius

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If your wife wants to go back to the Ukraine instead of fighting her start planning to move with her.  You could rent out your Canadian property give up your job and try living in Ukraine or you could sell and move.  Get excited by the prospect of moving to Ukraine get your wife to manage the project.   Maybe she will move your family to Ukraine or maybe she will give up trying because of the work load.  I thought marriage was a partnership not you dominating your wife to stay in Canada.  Do you love your wife and would go to the ends of the earth for her or is she a domestic appliance.  It's Ukraine not the ends of the earth.


Are you kidding?  Ukrainians are coming here in droves, because life in Ukraine is a dead end.  Why would you subject your child to this?  Why give up life, and presumably, a job that affords you a middle class lifestyle to go to a country with an average annual income of less than US$5,000?   


This post was composed without the aid of google.
To love someone means to see him as God intended him. - Fyodor Dostoevksy

Offline Jamesukjames

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You would move to Ukraine simply because your wife wanted to .  Nothing like a reality check.   Although I suspect she is communicating with an old male friend in the Ukraine.   Women don't usually  leave a relationship without a plan and support.  I don't know about Canada but I could definitely live a better quality of life renting my house  out in London and moving to a Minsk high quality dacha .  There are plenty  of good private schools in Ukraine for $100 a month.

Offline Jamesukjames

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I can't comment on Canada but I could definetly understand a Ukrainian wanting to go home after sampling UK culture.

Offline Boethius

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Most women moving back to Ukraine from the West (very rare, BTW, precisely because of the difference in lifestyle) move back to parents, not a man waiting in the wings.  In Ukraine, still, most men don't want to raise another man's child.

If you are retired, moving may work, but raising children in Ukraine is no picnic.  If you are under 60, you are giving up all pension years to live on passive income, with its attendant problems (tenants destroying your property, for one), excellent free healthcare, excellent dental care, prescriptions you know are not adulterated, a country with the rule of law and relatively corruption free, the list goes on. 

My MIL always says to the better half "You can't imagine what is going on here.  I am so happy you were able to move somewhere where you can live a normal life."

Things may be different in Belarus, it was always far less corrupt than Ukraine, partly because of its history. 

As for Canada, most Ukrainians get homesick at some point, but I know a lot of Ukrainians from Ukraine, and not one has returned voluntarily. 

This post was composed without the aid of google.



To love someone means to see him as God intended him. - Fyodor Dostoevksy

Offline Jamesukjames

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A friend of mine had a restaurant his parents built up the business and gave it to him.   Along came a Hungarian waitress who he married and had two sons with.  After five years of marriage she wanted to go back to Hungary to a former lover.  My friends ex wife now lives in an apartment with her hungarain man and my friends 2 kids who now speak no English.  Her parents now live in an apartment in the same block.  My friend had to sell the restaurant to give his ex wife half the capital in the business.

Offline Boethius

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That's the UK, I assume.  In Canada, assets acquired before marriage are exempt from matrimonial property division.  If there is a prenuptial agreement, the increase in value during marriage also is exempt.  If there is no prenup, then the increase in value during the marriage is split 50/50, but the starting date for valuation is the date of marriage.

In my province, a home owned by one partner before marriage, even if a matrimonial home, is exempt from matrimonial division, although absent a prenup, the increase in value during marriage is split 50/50.  That is different in other provinces.  In Ontario, for example, the matrimonial home is split 50/50, regardless of when it was acquired.

Hungary is not Ukraine.  Their attitudes are different, their way of life is different.  The country most like Ukraine in terms of attitudes and way of life is Russia.

This post was composed without the aid of google.
« Last Edit: February 18, 2019, 05:06:03 PM by Boethius »
To love someone means to see him as God intended him. - Fyodor Dostoevksy

Offline monkey

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monkey how old is your son ??
SX
Almost 2   :)
Monkey I have been where you are exactly the same scenario and I made most of the classic mistakes you are making and eventually ended up divorced on the plus side because I remained a rock my ex eventually moved to live 500 meters from me.  Ok you know the worst case scenarios now put them to the back of your mind.  You will only get out of this situation if you alpha up.  Firstly your wife is acting up because she feels unsupported in some way. 
I don't want to be an Alpha. I just want to be me. Her reasons for acting up, I have no idea why. Don't care to online diagnose it, nothing against you I just have enough on my plate.
If your wife wants to go back to the Ukraine instead of fighting her start planning to move with her.  Do you love your wife and would go to the ends of the earth for her or is she a domestic appliance.  It's Ukraine not the ends of the earth.

We have different views James and both of us can be right. If not for my son, I would move in a heartbeat, I believe for my child a better future is in Canada, at least for now.
Thanks for the input James!
If you are retired, moving may work, but raising children in Ukraine is no picnic.  If you are under 60, you are giving up all pension years to live on passive income, with its attendant problems (tenants destroying your property, for one), excellent free healthcare, excellent dental care, prescriptions you know are not adulterated, a country with the rule of law and relatively corruption free, the list goes on. 
My MIL always says to the better half "You can't imagine what is going on here.  I am so happy you were able to move somewhere where you can live a normal life."
This post was composed without the aid of google.
Right or wrong, my thinking too!
TYVM Boethius

This thinking leads into my next post to follow...

Offline monkey

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I just want to start off with a thanks for all your time and heartfelt comments.
Serious domestic marriage problems could be exponentially problematic in an international marriage. I regret when  I started this journey, I didn't consider the possible implications of parenting international children.  My advice: Have the raising our child talk before saying 'I do'. Get on the same page about child rearing and expectations.

Here is a new little wrinkle in my wife's character. Yes, there is out of control obsessiveness. But also there is a control freak obsession over our son.
I am not allowed to do anything.
My opinion counts for nothing.

So continuing on from Boethius's last post from above, I am also perplexed by my spouses 'desire' to return with our son to live in Ukraine.

This makes no sense....
She offered to go to a lawyer and sign off a 300k+ (napkin math) settlement if I give up parental rights to allow to move.
But she really wants (and time is getting close) to receive Canadian citizenship.
Read that 3 times please. I know krimster2 only read it once, he's a busy guy )

And this woman is smart and cunning. Does that scare you? It scares me! Ukraine is a country where you eat or get eaten.

I have spoken with a gentleman at CBSA (Canada Border Services Agency) named M. M told me our Canadian passport is the third most valued passport.

The last fact in this post is I know beyond any doubt she does not want me to have any part of custody. No way, no how. This alone I believe could incite abduction.
I have generously been offered; unlimited skype bonding time with my son, visit him in ukraine whenever, supervised access for a few hours at a time.


Offline Jamesukjames

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Well you have 2 choices fight or bend.  It seems like you are already fighting with everyone your soon  to be ex . Myself  and you are already going down the lawyers route as you are already having war like discussions with your wife.  So now my advice is talk to friends about which lawyers gave the best service and value for money and the best outcomes.  From my experience an ocd woman will only bow to recognised authority so everything will be sorted via the official agencies until your child is 18 with many 're tests of the authorities powers.  So actually how your life In relation to your child will be will be what the agencies decide .  So time to man up stop waling and walk the path my friend.

Offline Jamesukjames

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A cunning woman as you quote will say many things to your face.  It's what's written down by her lawyers and the agencies that counts.  So best to stop listening to this and pay a good lawyer.

Online krimster2

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the more details you provide of your plight the less hope I feel for you...
IMHO, the only possibility for you to salvage your marriage is for her to get Zoloft and wait a month...

iím 100% certain she will not accept this...

but there is some missing information
her desire to return home, only makes sense if she feels her life with you is a failure...
this I donít understand...
most Russian women are SO FREAKIN HAPPY to be living outside of Russia
my wifeís last visit to her family this past summer was so disappointing for her, that has lost all desire to ever return...

thatís why THIS is a pretty major issue...
whatís driving this?  the conflict with you, or something else, like she canít handle all the changes necessary for her to live in your culture?  or both?  or something else?
but this issue whatever it is, is the catalyst for promoting her ďsymptomsĒ
or maybe, she had this EXACT ISSUE in Russia and thought she could solve it by moving to your country

then thereís you...
I saw your sarcasm about ďamazing KreskinĒ, that was a big fail on your part
never use sarcasm with a Russian
never use sarcasm with a person who has mental health issues
and NEVER NEVER use sarcasm on a Russian woman who has mental health issues
OK!!!!
seriously, this culture is one of the worse for communicating
so you have to dig to find the answers, so Iíd go get a shovel if I were you
vodka is a useful tool for loosening Russian tongues...

Iíve never been in your situation, Iím sure if it wasnít for your son, the two of you would have split long ago....

Iím sure you must feel the temptation to just let him go with her
when it would be in YOUR best interest, but certainly not your sonís
and that's probably tormenting you

« Last Edit: February 19, 2019, 09:18:47 AM by krimster2 »

Offline monkey

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Iím sure you must feel the temptation to just let him go with her
when it would be in YOUR best interest, but certainly not your sonís
and that's probably tormenting you
You are right.

dont have a lot of time now but:
Kreskin comment was just a joke for this board. never happened.
Wife has declared she is not going for citizenship test and interview tomorrow. The last step!


Offline Jamesukjames

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Maybe you have found one of the problems OCD women are perfectionists they do not like to fail and so would rather not turn up for exams where they might fail.  I lived alongside an ocd woman and still do for 20 years.  Sadly OCD women do their male partners no good as you end up feeling not good enough.  You may find out you were part of a lifestyle plan rather than truly loved.  Also OCD women definetly think of children as lifestyle possessions rather than humans and as your son gets older his imperfections as in normality will annoy her so you certainly have a role to play in his life to show him normal life rather than her OCD lifestyle.  Strangely the more you try to influence ocd women the more they defy you there really is no winning.  Although the court systems in Canada do sound much more fair than uk

Offline Boethius

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If she is that adamant, I agree with James, go see a lawyer quietly.  Clean out joint accounts to minimum levels.  Go to one who specializes in high conflict custody disputes.  You may not divorce, but you should see someone sooner, rather than later.  You may not have a dispute if you divorce, but having the option to respond with someone who deals with high conflict divorces is always better.

This post was composed without the aid of google.
« Last Edit: February 21, 2019, 12:53:35 AM by Boethius »
To love someone means to see him as God intended him. - Fyodor Dostoevksy

Online BdHvA

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As others have noted I fear this will end up in front of a judge. I cannot comment on Canadian law but I suspect you have an uphill battle before you. There is good advice that has been posted.

Starting with this thread, I would keep a diary. In 15 pr so years you will have something to give your son that will speak more clearly than hours of words.

Sometimes you must let go so that you can hold onto the big prize.
Experierence is not what happens to you. It is what you do with what happens to you. A. Huxley

Online msmob

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Hi Monkey

Sorry things appear to be going pear-shaped

My right to contact was fought 17 years ago and in one country - although I was resident in another country and came back for visits and Court hearings and even to be assessed by Family Court appointed Psychiatrists


I 'won' all contact Family Court hearings, but they were pyrrhic victories as the mother of my kids just ignored the rulings - missed agreed contact

My daughters wouldn't read the Court findings when they achieved majority - choosing to believe their Mum's 'version'....

Can YOU start off by trying / suggesting arbitration in Canada ?

It SEEMS like your partner may be seeking her cake and trying to eat it

Good luck

Offline monkey

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hey gang,
past few months have been up and down with lots of drama.
I have succumbed for our family to visit ukraine. Leaving later today. I have no idea how this will go.
Wife is packing her suitcase now as I type. Had a huge argument couple hours ago when I commented that all she is packing are gifts and there will be no room for clothes (honestly!). She actually made me go sit in my basement computer room while she packed. Said it was or I was causing her stress.
That makes no sense to me !
I fear I am walking into a snake pit and I have no real world support. Only a forum. Will keep you informed. If Bo or someone else who speaks russian can inbox me their viber number, I could sure use the help with any russian documents that get  thrown my way to sign while there. I could be signing my way out of child custody without knowing it.

Online msmob

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Did you sign the docs, already ?   Without knowing what they mean ? !

You can take photos of them and google will translate them - as a start ..

IF your lady was intending not to come back - surely she'd be packing clothes - not gifts ... Gifts imply she is being thoughtful to those back home ..?

Online SteveInBoston

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No notary or lawyer can accept any document you sign that is not bilingual, or without a certified translator present.  Not 100% - someone can be bribed to look the other way, I guess.

Online BillyB

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hey gang,
past few months have been up and down with lots of drama.
I have succumbed for our family to visit ukraine. Leaving later today. I have no idea how this will go.
Wife is packing her suitcase now as I type. Had a huge argument couple hours ago when I commented that all she is packing are gifts and there will be no room for clothes (honestly!). She actually made me go sit in my basement computer room while she packed. Said it was or I was causing her stress.
That makes no sense to me !
I fear I am walking into a snake pit and I have no real world support. Only a forum. Will keep you informed. If Bo or someone else who speaks russian can inbox me their viber number, I could sure use the help with any russian documents that get  thrown my way to sign while there. I could be signing my way out of child custody without knowing it.

It's been 4 1/2 months since  you started this thread. I assume your wife got her Canadian citizenship.

I see a problem in you that is a major turn off for women. You have agreed to let your wife and kid go to Ukraine but you're still acting paranoid that you're going to lose your child. Paranoya will destroya. Quit worrying until you have somehting to worry about. Give your wife a big hug and tell her to enjoy her time there.

Based on your posts here, your wife doesn't respect you and doesn't value your opinion on how to raise your son. I don't know if you're going to lose your son but I think your marriage will end eventually. A woman can't love you if she doesn't respect you. You need to figure out how to get that respect.

I wouldn't want to be in your shoes but if I were in your shoes married to a woman who doesn't respect me, I'd make the first move to divorce telling her she needs to find a man she can respect.

You need to find a woman that respects you. Life is too short to live with a person who constantly disrespects you. It's an unhealthy situation for both of you and your child to constantly watch this while growing up.
There are people that will pass info about you and your family. Do not share info about yourself or share photos as they can search for you on the internet and distribute what they found since they are allowed to participate here.

Offline monkey

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I wrote a long detailed post. Posted but wifi stopped. .. fff.
Am going on little sleep in 2 days.
Wrote tons before but important to me was i realized as i wrote this.... wife spent $1200 on useless gifts. 300 was at airport !  I realized now she may want to show her intention to return to canada.
I am really snookered. I only want to so right. I was confident and smart. Now sound crazy.
Wifes Mon has been dying since 2016. I gave 10k for brain tumor opp.
Now dying again of evasive illness.  Many things wrong...
This could be excuse for wife to stay after 5 week stay. Why she insisted on 5 weeks?
Her goal i was told, tru or not, was cdn citizenship  done...  divorce and get my $$.
Much more was lost last post try.

Offline monkey

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She insisted on bringing birth cert of son and our certified copy of marr cert. That church needs for baptism approval.
I do i leave ukr now without my son  ? 
She has me on child care. She has controlled all since day 1. I ffffed thT too.
Finlaw at bankomat stood behind me trying ro see PIN. i told him ro turn around...
« Last Edit: June 25, 2019, 07:51:53 PM by monkey »

Offline monkey

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J mom gave her a tee shirt with "bad girl' written on it. And it had a pair of handcuffs broken open. Like the girl escaped.

I asked j after if she will be a bad girl. J said she already is a bad girl.
WTF. never heard thT talk..


Online BillyB

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I wrote a long detailed post. Posted but wifi stopped. .. fff.


Copy everything before hitting the "post" button so if things get lost, you will be able to paste what you copied when wifi or internet is back up. But if you reset the computer, you will lose what you copied.
There are people that will pass info about you and your family. Do not share info about yourself or share photos as they can search for you on the internet and distribute what they found since they are allowed to participate here.

Offline monkey

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And she packed the portable hard drive with 16K pics of our boy with her. At that point i cancelled the trip a night before leaving. I was panicked bout all of it. But no one to talk too so i relented.
Why bring 16K of pics home. She could viber any she wanted. I dont deserve  it when so bloody dumb......

 

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