The train came off the tracks

[Jazzyclassy]

Well I do not know I did not like her cos there was something about her you can not see  it is hidden so so far away , it is very hard to trust a person who by all his means , appearance is trying to show how she is the best of all the rest and moreover DKMM is not the only one guy who was persuing her that time(at least that was how she portrayed it like she did not hold his hand was walking like she sees him for the first time ), that were my own impressions about her.

I am not saying she is bad , maybe she is amazing  to some girls and guys , though  according to my opinion I would not deal with the woman who has problems within her personality and who was asking me every question about my relations and where am I living and where am I studying and where working, when we met only for the first and the last time, meanwhile she never answered clearly about herself, so basicly at the end of that meeting she knew everything about me and I knew only the thing that she is very secretive undercover hidden personality whom you can not trust! What else can I say ..... it is perfectly clear

[DKMM]

Hi all,

Well once again I'm glad to provide some real spunk to RWD lately.  If only more guys laid their troubles out to bare on here! Ok joking aside yes J retrieved the ring.  She is quite convinced I should be able to work this out, and she knows me better than almost anyone... but she also thinks I have better things to do than to spend more energy on E.  Ranetka, J isn't the next one, she was the previous one.  And she is one of my best friends.

Yup Serebro I am good looking and charming to boot but I am soo immature poor me.  

Jazzy, yes E never really liked to talk about herself.  That was both good and bad.

I have to say that E used to do all those things right.  That is how I noticed the changes so much because she used to be there more for me.  True, she liked to spend time with her friends a lot, and there is nothing wrong with that.  Also, she said that she really gets lonely and that's why she goes out to whereever in the countryside most weekends.  I can't expect my RW to stay home everyweekend for 6 months...  Maybe we drifted apart or whatever, but the fact is I ended this based on her desire to not see me during her somewhat busy holidays.  That's taking me for granted and saying "i'll see you in march when the visa comes" was icing on the cake.  I may have misinterpreted that as it happens commonly (could have been her immature way of getting me to come see her when she's available later in January, but I'm not due to work).  That's about all I have further to say on the matter.  I might take some time away from here as family is coming in from all over and the holidays are coming (Remember Ken I have a big close family).
 

[Jazzyclassy]

Agree 100%.

Is it only me who finds asking "the next one" to collect engagement ring from ex-fiance rather ...  ehh distasteful?

well I can agree it is a little bit kinda not comfortable, but I think it is a right decision to pick up the ring , I believe there are loads of other great presents that she can keep , that will be enough for her !!!!
yeah but if that ring was very very expensive and maybe he owe's money to people for this,

[Serebro]

Well I do not know I did not like her cos there was something about her you can not see  it is hidden so so far away , it is very hard to trust a person who by all his means , appearance is trying to show how she is the best of all the rest and moreover DKMM is not the only one guy who was persuing her that time(at least that was how she portrayed it like she did not hold his hand was walking like she sees him for the first time ), that were my own impressions about her.

I am not saying she is bad , maybe she is amazing  to some girls and guys , though  according to my opinion I would not deal with the woman who has problems within her personality and who was asking me every question about my relations and where am I living and where am I studying and where working, when we met only for the first and the last time, meanwhile she never answered clearly about herself, so basicly at the end of that meeting she knew everything about me and I knew only the thing that she is very secretive undercover hidden personality whom you can not trust! What else can I say ..... it is perfectly clear

Jazzy, her intention to make you speak and at the same time her "being secret"about herself can also be considered to be a sign of a good psychologyst. Most people I know like telling about themselves and speaking about their own problems.

At the same time DKMM and his family has visited her many times and his opinion of her was rather high and he even started a visa process... so why to turn everything into "It was suspicious from the very beginning and to turn all the facts that seemed to be fine at the beginning into"oh, that's really suspicious, how could you date her"?!
Nobody is perfect.
If you really wish to see bad things you will be able to turn her behavior into bad one, if you want to see good things you will see good sides only and advantages.

He visited her many times, they lived together and it was fine, then he moved away, she didn't like that he called on weekends and she became completely bad...


No, I am not trying to defend her.I just don't like the tendency to tell only good things about someone and then in a couple of months/days say bad things about the same person which are based on nothing but someone else's words...

[Kuna]

Serebro,

Out of interest...  do you think it's acceptable, reasonable or understandable for a girl.. any girl.. to not want to see her fiance at New Years?

[BillyB]

Is it only me who finds asking "the next one" to collect engagement ring from ex-fiance rather ...  ehh distasteful?

Gifts should never asked to be given back. If the ring is an heirloom of DKMM's family, then absolutely it should be given back. Most likely the engagement ring is not a gift or an heirloom but simply an "engagement ring" that carries a commitment with it and if the woman was not sincerely interested in marriage and not truly commited to DKMM, I have no problem with DKMM asking for it back.  

[Photo Guy]

Gator made a really good point by mentioning this:

'Interesting that she sent her "household stuff" ahead of her arrival.  Very interesting!  You would think that she would do that only if she believed they would marry and stay.'

This is bothering me. It just does not fit in the overall story. I'm not sure what happened between these two people. I don't think we're seeing the whole story.

Maybe the bottom line is that these two are incompatible and she assumed (as did he)
that the ups and downs were going to be acceptable in their marriage, or maybe they believed they would 'reform' each other. So by her sending her stuff to him, she
shows us that she was committed. Or at least committed at that moment in time, when she sent her stuff.

In a way, a hot/cold rollercoaster relationship can be exciting, but it's immature and far from what you really need and deserve. There are couples who 'enjoy' fighting too.

[Serebro]

Serebro,

Out of interest...  do you think it's acceptable, reasonable or understandable for a girl.. any girl.. to not want to see her fiance at New Years?

No,I am not defending her, I don't understand people who are acccusing her on something that DKMM wrote about.
If he wrote that about the girl without a photo that would be fine, but a half of the internet knows what she looks like and people who know her may read about it. And who can check if this information is reliable?!


PS:Personally I have one reason not to want to meet my fiance at New Years-it's when I look worse than I did when he saw me for the last time.

[DKMM]

Hmm well now she's ready to see me during holidays on my terms.  Anybody here surprised?  Maybe we are both too stubborn.

Yeah actually i took a suitcase of her belongings back with me each trip since engagement.  I have all of her warm weather clothing as she would not have needed it till she gets here...plus more "junk".

And why do I have the feeling Serebro would enjoy meeting my mama?

OK like I said before I'm gonna disappear for a while from here.  Somebody post a crazy TR or something and let this thread die...

[Jazzyclassy]

Hmm well now she's ready to see me during holidays on my terms.  Anybody here surprised?  Maybe we are both too stubborn.

Yeah actually i took a suitcase of her belongings back with me each trip since engagement.  I have all of her warm weather clothing as she would not have needed it till she gets here...plus more "junk".

And why do I have the feeling Serebro would enjoy meeting my mama?

OK like I said before I'm gonna disappear for a while from here.  Somebody post a crazy TR or something and let this thread die...

Oi DKMMochka  do not make more mistakes, then again would you listen to those preachings?

[Turboguy]

Hmm well now she's ready to see me during holidays on my terms.  Anybody here surprised?  Maybe we are both too stubborn.

No, I am not the least bit surprised.   I won't even be surprised when you tell us that you saw her for the holidays.   I can however think of many more appropriate words than "stubborn".

Sometimes RWD gets a little quiet for a while and then something catches everyones attention and off it goes again.   Having been in the center of it I can say it is always nice to see someone else there instead.   It is sort of the price you may pay for sharing your feelings, baring your soul, allowing your relationship and your dreams to be an open book but sometimes it helps us grow and become stronger as a person and sometimes another's view can help a lot.   Othertimes it will be like they are talking to a brick wall.   

P/G, I think you are right and there are things we are not hearing.  This is a time the other side of the story could be quite interesting. 

[Gator]

And the drama continues to unfold.....It is good, DKMM, that you are taking a holiday break. 

Meanwhile, please do not call E.  It is for your own good. I say that because your personalities do not match, and that would wear on you over time.  Both of you are young and perhaps you will change and grow more compatible.  However, that would take time and could not be resolved within your current K-1 timeframe. 

It is best that both of you date other people.  If you are sincerely interested in her as a friend, SMS her at New Years and call her monthly to see how she is doing.    And maybe....?  That is what happened to me after I told myself "Never". 

Tell me, how will you feel when you see her face newly listed on a marriage agency, perhaps a photo taken by you?


Meanwhile, over the holidays some of us will keep stirring the pot - no telling what great psychological analysis will have been made by the time you return.

[Gator]

serebro,

Personally I have one reason not to want to meet my fiance at New Years-it's when I look worse than I did when he saw me for the last time.

Where is the Russian pride?  You need to believe:

-  You always look good (unless you were in a car wreck the day before). 
-  You are better looking than anyone else your fiance could attract. 
-  Your relationship has elevated above the superficial stage to the kindres soul stage.

BTW, I recall that Jazzy never had much good to say about E.  Yet, I agree with you that some people are reserved if not the silent type - it is the way they are.

[Jazzyclassy]

  some people are reserved if not the silent type - it is the way they are.      

She was not reserved in that meaning of this word, she was asking questions yet never answered properly on the questions posed to her.
No you are not gonna tell me that I do not know the types of how people are , I know there are naturally reserved people , she was not that, she was tricky , searching for some purpose in everyone and everything, you can understand a lot about the person by his appearance and by his conversation and actions all together, so my all together impression about her was negative, plus her indifferent look , seemed like she was rushing somewhere to a business meeting and  the thing that she was with DKMM was just her waste of time, but she did that cos she wanted free meal and money.  Again to my mind such behaviour of a person shows her attitude and reveals a lot of things about her.

I mean if she was reserved she would be sitting at home all the weekends , yet she goes out all the time with her numerous friends and you call that reserved  dear Gator ?

[KenC]

Sadly, folks, I do not think we have heard the last from "Drama boy" on this girl.
Stay tuned for the next edition of "As My Stomach Turns."
An American soap opera with a distinct Russian flavor.  Maybe we could get it dubbed into Portuguese and shown in Brazil?
KenC

[Son of Clyde]

KenC, why do you always resort to sarcasm "drama boy" and try to belittle people?
At least some of the others are trying to be somewhat decent about this.
It is no wonder some people are afraid to post here.

[KenC]

KenC, why do you always resort to sarcasm "drama boy" and try to belittle people?
At least some of the others are trying to be somewhat decent about this.
It is no wonder some people are afraid to post here.

Clyde,
I think the title of "Drama boy" is well earned  by DKMM.  With his on, off, on again, off again and soon to be on again relationship peppered with moronic thoughts of cz rings and emotional posts, calling him "Drama boy" is rather kind IMO.  BTW I did not rub his nose in all that blew up in his face as I warned him it would.  But now that I sense he is crawling back into the same ol same ol in spite of all the obvious glaring red flags, he deserves all the misery he is sure to find.  His actions are almost self abusive.  IMO the boy loves all the drama. :selfharm:
KenC

[Daveman]

At first when I read that now he may be going to visit for the holidays, I thought "Good lord.. Instant Idiot... just add EEEEEEEE".. but what the hell, it's his life.. however......

DKMM, from reading your other posts, it seems you are prone to using threats of relationship death to get what you want.. to, in essence, emotionally beat her into getting your way.  You mentioned this type of behavior in other posts.  Emotional games really have zero place in relationships and if you need to resort that to kind of tactic, there is a serious problem.  Think about it. Is that *really* the kind of man you are? is that what you want to be?

Was this engagement ring retrieval an emotional whack over the head to bend her to your will by showing "I am serious THIS time.. I will end this if you don't straighten up"..  without real intention, only bluff....you said before that she doesn't believe your threats anymore.. so you had to take a more drastic measure this time?

If I'm wrong, then fine.. but if not.. you really need to get yourself, your emotions in order before getting deeper into the abyss.  That kind of emotional mind phuck is not the way to go.  There's nothing "strong" about it.  It's juvenile at best, and at worst it's emotional battering. 

Dave

[Ranetka]

Gifts should never asked to be given back. If the ring is an heirloom of DKMM's family, then absolutely it should be given back. Most likely the engagement ring is not a gift or an heirloom but simply an "engagement ring" that carries a commitment with it and if the woman was not sincerely interested in marriage and not truly commited to DKMM, I have no problem with DKMM asking for it back.  

I think I am OK with asking for engagement ring to be returned. What bothers me it is the way it's being done. I mean asking the third party, even if it is not "the next one" (the "previous one") to collect it? What is wrong with DHL or other carrier? You can insure the content, seal the package, my friend who sell jeverly gets all her staff shipped from abroad. Or why not to collect it on his next trip to Russia? (he he, together with returning her goods). I do not know, I really am not sure.

[BillyB]

 DKMM's fiancee always gives him enough rope to let him pull him back into the game. Based on that letter she wrote, she knows she's going to do things that turn him off but she knows what she needs to do to turn him on again.

She's the puppetmaster controlling the strings. No matter how many times you want to pull free, you can't.

DKMM, it doesn't hurt to walk away from the k-1 and date other women to see if there's better out there. She rather spend her weekends with other people instead of taking your calls. Her actions speak louder than words. Why are you rushing this? This boy chase girl and girl chase boy emotional rollercoaster ride is juvenile. Most of us other guys have been there, done that and we know it ends in disaster. This woman hasn't displayed the consistency of commitment, devotion, love, and attention most us guys have known with our women that don't play games. Based on reading here, you know these women exist. Do you want one? She's probably on a dating/marriage site right now waiting for you to contact her.

Be that strong RM that your fiancee wants and walk away now. Each time you come back for more punishment, she loses respect for you. One day she will have no respect for you at all and she'll go after a third husband right after she takes a huge chunk of your assets during a long and nasty divorce that'll take a couple of years off your life.

DKMM, one thing I notice is that you provided very little information that describes her as marriage material. Her looks won't last forever, there needs to be something there that you can respect till the end of time. What are those things you respect?

Ranetka, asking a third party to collect the ring may not be a bad idea after all. If two people are to separate which both can have bitter feelings, it's best they don't see each other at all. Sending the ring by DHL with insurance could get expensive for his fiancee. If DKMM broke the relations, then she should not have to pay for shipping and insurance.

[Ranetka]

Ranetka, asking a third party to collect the ring may not be a bad idea after all. If two people are to separate which both can have bitter feelings, it's best they don't see each other at all. Sending the ring by DHL with insurance could get expensive for his fiancee. If DKMM broke the relations, then she should not have to pay for shipping and insurance.

How will the third party pass the ring to him?

Again, it is probably just me. To me it looks a bit like when a schoolboy asks a schoolgirl to tell her friend he does not like her anymore. May be it is me, I belive in not including other people into break of relationship. But I can see since noone else shares my point of veiw I am probably wrong here. If it happened to me, I would not give the ring to the third party, especially if it was an ex or current girlfriend.

[BC]

A wise old friend told me once:

If an apple has a worm, no matter how you bite into it you will never fully enjoy the experience..

[BC]

.. and then he asked me - what is the sense of dealing with that wormy apple when the orchard is full of apples ready for the pickin'.

[Photo Guy]

Some great highlights from BillyB:

'..Each time you come back for more punishment, she loses respect for you..'
and
'..Her looks won't last forever, there needs to be something there that you can respect till the end of time. What are those things you respect?'

!!DKMM, without respect, your marriage with her will be total sh!t.

[Daveman]

some excellent points and thoughts.  I believe we are witnessing what in hindsight will become one of the largest, most profound learning experiences of his life.  Sad that the hand basket will inevitably reach the destination of Hell before the lesson is learned, but most of us has had to go through it ourselves before we would gain that grain of wisdom.  What will be, will be.  So, let's go play in the orchard!