I'm still not convinced! The official stats just don't make sense!

[Gator]

Eduard,

If she [a AW] is as single, as pretty, as nice and as blond as you decribe her I would seriously consider her if I were you.

I guess you are saying this tongue-in-cheek.  I will elaborate just to contrast with RW.

The blond was even better than I described: graduated with honors, won regional American Idol show, million dollar smile and personality, and an incredible sense of humor.

What's wrong with her:  following typical AW game theory she dumped me then calls again, her hobby was to smoke dope all day, knew my very comfortable financial situation better than a RW could ever comprehend,  she could not decide between pursuing a career in music or having a baby neither of which is in my future, she is too young (older in years than my RW but younger in every other aspect), and she dated Jerry Springer.

Now how many RW are like that? 

She was a great "divorce starter" kit and for that I will be forever thankful.  BTW, she has found a young MD who has moved to be near her.  I hope the two find happiness.

[WmGO]

Are Russian women (Generally speaking) a trade up?

IMO the answer is no. :hairraising: :hairraising:

Agree with that. In general terms, they are not the "traditional" women they
are sold as being MUCH less the "greatest women in the world" either.

Is it just me, or does anyone else dislike the term "trade up?" 

No, you are not the only one. I think the term is just another made up by WM term that is nothing more than another of the many sanctimonious and/or ignorant and/or foolish rationalizations/justifications (or whatever) for their pursuit of FSUW - or the term just represents some kind of self esteem issue on the part of the WM.

Personally, during the times I was actively pursuing FSUW my mindset was the same as when I am pursuing AW: I am looking for a women who is *my* EQUAL - one who is good enough for *me* in terms of physical looks, intelligence (not neccessarily education), out going spirit, and basic decency and goodness.

However, it should be noted that for some WM the FSUW may very well constitute some kind of "trade up". For these men, they better know for sure true love and commitment exists and they better work hard to keep in that way.

******************

Edward, my post to you above was not directed to you, but to the Board in general as I was noticing here and elsewhere men were trying to make pigeon hole generalizations about all FSUW. Personally, I think you are correct that, generally, there are more eligible marriage minded FSUW than FSUM in their 20s and 30s (maybe older age categories also). If you look at age and gender statistics alone for that age group, this would not be true, but if you consider "marriage material" and "marital interest" you begin to see the disparity.


I have consistently read over the years that about 60% of RM and UM are hard core alchoholics, and that around 5% are drug addicts. This alone creates a tremendous disparity. Add in FSUM attitudes pertaining to adultry and mistresses, and you add to the disparity as not all FSUW approve of that cultural reality. Throw in the fact that many FSUM have not done well in the transition from Communism to free markets and constantly have employment problems and the disparity between marriagable FSUW and FSUM again grows wider....

Of course, in all fairness to FSUM, there are issues pertaining to many FSUW that in my eyes would substantially decrease the percentage of "marriagable" women from a quality perspective.

*******************

Fat American women? Don't get me started!  

Well you got me started: if 80% of American *adults* are either fat or obese and adulthood
is considered as starting at age 18, what is the statistic for AW in their late 20s and
30s? From what I see every day, it is probably higher that the 80% figure that applies
to the general adult population.  

[I/O]

Is it just me, or does anyone else dislike the term "trade up?"

Gator: Most often the words/things we don't like are the ones which draw a reaction from within, and in so doing make us think about what we are doing. That is the reason I deliberately chose the term "Trade up".

Is anyone here prepared to say their current wife, fiance', girlfriend or whatever is not a significant step up, trade up, better person, whatever term you like to choose, than their previous partners? If you are, you had better hope your RW ain't reading.

I've heard the most screwball justifications trying to normalise this caper and frankly, IMO, even in this day and age, this international relationship thing is very far from run of the mill. Most of us who are seriously involved are social misfits in some form or another. I am because I choose to be. Hell, that's why I went travelling and that's what started this whole thing. The local scene is fun and I enjoy it, but it doesn't really capture me. Thus I don't really fit.

Could I go out on Friday night and find any amount of pleasant female company? Could I get laid if and when I chose? Could I have gotten married again locally? The answer was and is yes to all three questions, but I still wasn't seeing "My Fit" and I still don't. When I met a couple of women in and airport in Moscow quite some years back (One of them was working there) and later shared coffee with them, I couldn't know that I was to find my "Fit" among them. I just wasn't in the mood to even think about it.

Put my now wife on the catwalk with my ex wife (Which they have both done at least in small part) and other than one being blonde and one being brunette, if a guy was going on the 1-10 thing, they would be much or a muchness, BUT my current wife is a huge trade up, step up, nicer person, better fit, whatever comfortable term you choose, for me.

IMO, if you don't recognise a little of the trade up, step up thing in your relationship then you are not telling yourself the whole truth.

The results of my international travels and or sparadic dating go like this, I dated a few really smart ladies short term or lightly, I dated a stunning lady long term (We lived together for 6 months at a later stage) who was the daughter of the military chief of staff in her country and I would suggest by any measure she was near the top of the tree. BTW, she was not FSU. (I terminated the relationship for some quite important, but perhaps somewhat obscure reasons) I ultimately met and married someone I consider to be of very high quality and in all the above, they are/were generally speaking a trade up, step up, better/nicer/more interesting women than I find in any great number locally, so the international thing for me was certainly a trade up.

I/O

[Eduard]

Agree with that. In general terms, they are not the "traditional" women they
are sold as being MUCH less the "greatest women in the world" either.


No, you are not the only one. I think the term is just another made up by WM term that is nothing more than another of the many sanctimonious and/or ignorant and/or foolish rationalizations/justifications (or whatever) for their pursuit of FSUW - or the term just represents some kind of self esteem issue on the part of the WM.

Personally, during the times I was actively pursuing FSUW my mindset was the same as when I am pursuing AW: I am looking for a women who is *my* EQUAL - one who is good enough for *me* in terms of physical looks, intelligence (not necessarily education), out going spirit, and basic decency and goodness.

However, it should be noted that for some WM the FSUW may very well constitute some kind of "trade up". For these men, they better know for sure true love and commitment exists and they better work hard to keep in that way.

******************

Edward, my post to you above was not directed to you, but to the Board in general as I was noticing here and elsewhere men were trying to make pigeon hole generalizations about all FSUW. Personally, I think you are correct that, generally, there are more eligible marriage minded FSUW than FSUM in their 20s and 30s (maybe older age categories also). If you look at age and gender statistics alone for that age group, this would not be true, but if you consider "marriage material" and "marital interest" you begin to see the disparity.


I have consistently read over the years that about 60% of RM and UM are hard core alchoholics, and that around 5% are drug addicts. This alone creates a tremendous disparity. Add in FSUM attitudes pertaining to adultry and mistresses, and you add to the disparity as not all FSUW approve of that cultural reality. Throw in the fact that many FSUM have not done well in the transition from Communism to free markets and constantly have employment problems and the disparity between marriagable FSUW and FSUM again grows wider....

Of course, in all fairness to FSUM, there are issues pertaining to many FSUW that in my eyes would substantially decrease the percentage of "marriagable" women from a quality perspective.

*******************

Fat American women? Don't get me started!  

Well you got me started: if 80% of American *adults* are either fat or obese and adulthood
is considered as starting at age 18, what is the statistic for AW in their late 20s and
30s? From what I see every day, it is probably higher that the 80% figure that applies
to the general adult population.  

Thanks for posting this!!! I was beginning to feel like Galileo in front of the inquisition court for stating my honest opinion that the Earth is round!
Everything you wrote is correct and makes sense. I'm still puzzled where are all those men that supposedly exist according to statistics? Somebody posted in another thread of mine that all these men are either at work or they just don't go out and to malls.
Well, as far as I know most women also work in Russia and don't just hang out in shopping malls! And if you go out on a Saturday night you still see a lot more women than men pretty much anywhere you go. Has anyone else experienced this or am I hallucinating???

[I/O]

or am I hallucinating???

IMO, yes. Eduard, during the last 5 years, I haven't perhaps spent the time in Russia/FSU and a little further, you have, but let me list just a few cities/locations. Starting West, Bucharest, Bacau, Brasov, Kishinev, Riga, Odessa, Lugansk, Kiev, Moscow, Kursk, Ufa, Omsk, Tomsk, Krasnoyarsk, Irkutsk, Vladivostok, and a WHOLE HOST of other places in between................and I HAVE NEVER SEEN THE situation as you describe it.

You will see the girls in the parks and on the streets earlier in the afternoon/evening than the men. That's how it is.

IMO, based on reading your posts here, apart from retaining Russian language, in the 20 or so years you have lived in the west, I think you have completely lost the handle on Russia and you are seeing it on a fly in fly out basis in exactly the same way as the wish seekers see it. You are only seeing what you want to see and nothing more.

I do have to say, the more I read your posts, the more I question your "Russianess".

I/O

[Shadow]

Eduard, my experience is different. I have dated through Lavalife inside my country and outside of it, and interest was about the same. Yes the ratio of male/female members is different, but if you go by that statistic there should be 10 men for 1  woman, not the other way around. 

[BC]

Thanks for posting this!!! I was beginning to feel like Galileo in front of the inquisition court for stating my honest opinion that the Earth is round!

Eduard,

Now don't go overboard.. there is quite a difference between the 'round' you initially described and the definitions of 'round' that seem to be converging.

I see very little of your initial postings that has been significantly substantiated.

[Eduard]

IMO, yes. Eduard, during the last 5 years, I haven't perhaps spent the time in Russia/FSU and a little further, you have, but let me list just a few cities/locations. Starting West, Bucharest, Bacau, Brasov, Kishinev, Riga, Odessa, Lugansk, Kiev, Moscow, Kursk, Ufa, Omsk, Tomsk, Krasnoyarsk, Irkutsk, Vladivostok, and a WHOLE HOST of other places in between................and I HAVE NEVER SEEN THE situation as you describe it.

You will see the girls in the parks and on the streets earlier in the afternoon/evening than the men. That's how it is.

IMO, based on reading your posts here, apart from retaining Russian language, in the 20 or so years you have lived in the west, I think you have completely lost the handle on Russia and you are seeing it on a fly in fly out basis in exactly the same way as the wish seekers see it. You are only seeing what you want to see and nothing more.

I do have to say, the more I read your posts, the more I question your "Russianess".

I/O

this post so doesn't make sense that at first I didn't even want to dignify it with a reply.
First you say that yes, I am hallucinating, then you mention some cities that you supposedly had visited, some of them not even Russian (I thought we were only discussing RW and I have no idea of the situation in Hungary or other non-FSU countries) then you state that I lost my culture. This is just silly IMO.
FYI I spend 3-4 months out of the year in Russia, keep in touch with people I grew up with, went to school with and my relatives. How can one be "out of touch with his own culture and language doing that - beats me! On top of that I'm married to a RW with whom we only speak Russian at home, and my daughter at this point only speaks and understands Russian, other than just a few words in English! Most of our friends here in Florida are also Russians who live here, since my wife feels a lot more comfortable with them than Americans.

You wrote: "You are only seeing what you want to see and nothing more. " I think that this applies a lot more to you than I. I get the feeling that you really believe that you know best, is that very wise?

[I/O]

Eduard: Now we see why your stat's are so out of whack.

spent the time in Russia/FSU and a little further,

You don't seem to be able to read very well.

BTW. where did I mention Hungary? Get an atlas and learn some geography. You are showing a more and more limited knowledge.

How can one be "out of touch with his own culture and language doing that - beats me!

Where did I say you were out of touch with your language? As for the rest, yeah it beats me too, but that is surely what you are demonstarting because what I am seeing is different, very different.

Your whole premise is driven by the sales argument that there is so many excess girls in Russia that "I can find one for you". It is utter BS, you know it, I know it and any thinking person who has visited Russia recently knows it also.

Sure there is an abundance at the bottom end, but there ain't at the top end. There is a few at the top end who can be found and it takes just a bit more than the average Joe to find them.

lost the handle on Russia

I said nothing about culture or Russian people living abroad, I spoke of Russia. When you start showing substantiable numbers in your quotations, you will have then started to prove otherwise. Until then, you are simply another agent flaunting BS to turn a buck. Nothing more, nothing less.

Eduard, you have tried to grab some high ground in here, but it's a bit too late, your credibility was lost several weeks ago among those who know a thing or two about this caper. In a seperate forum, you were nominated for "Blowhard of the year". (Not by me)  Your challenge now is to gain some credibility. Substantiable facts would be a good place for you to start.

I/O

[Simoni]

Eduard I invite anyone of those people who send you a PM to post here.

In a word, Shadow...

NO.

In the term PM, P stands for Private or Personal...

Nuff' said.

[BC]

In a word, Shadow...

NO.

In the term PM, P stands for Private or Personal...

Nuff' said.

Don't think the intent was to divulge the content of any PM's but to invite lurkers to participate, or at least drop in and share their view on the subject.

Nothing wrong with that IMHO

or did I miss something?

[Eduard]

BTW. where did I mention Hungary? Get an atlas and learn some geography. You are showing a more and more limited knowledge.
I/O

Like I said, all the negative BS you are directing toward me in fact applies to you. Look in the mirrow first. Why don't you get an atlas and look where Bucharest is first before you make an idiotic statement like that? or did you not mention Bucharest??? I probably imagined that as well! You think you know it all, you spent a few weeks in Russia and that makes you an expert!?!?! And suddenly you are more in touch with the Russian culture than I am?... well life might (no, I think will) throw you a curve and will bring you back down to earth one day very soon. You sure need it.
I'm not even going to waste any more of my time responding to your posts so don't bother.

[Eduard]

In a word, Shadow...

NO.

In the term PM, P stands for Private or Personal...

Nuff' said.

Hi Simoni,
nice to see you here on the battlefield!
how is the misses?

[pitbull]

Like I said, all the negative BS you are directing toward me in fact applies to you. Look in the mirrow first. Why don't you get an atlas and look where Bucharest is first before you make an idiotic statement like that? or did you not mention Bucharest??? I probably imagined that as well! You think you know it all, you spent a few weeks in Russia and that makes you an expert!?!?! And suddenly you are more in touch with the Russian culture than I am?... well life might (no, I think will) throw you a curve and will bring you back down to earth one day very soon. You sure need it.
I'm not even going to waste any more of my time responding to your posts so don't bother.

 Eduard, you are just pathetic! How can anyone trust your knowledge and opinions (heaven forbid statistical data) if you have zero knowledge of the geography of the part of the world you are from and claim to have deep knowledge of? 

But anyways, your post made my day - so funny! 

[I/O]

Why don't you get an atlas and look where Bucharest is first before you make an idiotic statement like that? or did you not mention Bucharest???

Eduard: You mentioned Hungary, I mentioned Bucharest, I am still trying to imagine the link you are seeing between the two. :noidea:

Where you are going wrong here is assuming I think I know everything. I happen to know very little, but I know enough to know that some of what you are claiming is not correct. Thus I have challenged your line again and again. It is up to you to substantiate the claims you have put out there in the face of challenge. So far you have not been able to do so and in the process are displaying more and more limited knowledge.

Spitting out the dummy and walking away in the face of challenge is hardly the way to gain credability for your system/self. Sorry Eduard, you may be able to browbeat some of your clientelle into automatically accepting your view, but it doesn't cut the mustard with me.

BTW, there is the Google thing to help find where Bucharest is if you can't afford a decent atlas.

I/O

[Jet]

Bucharest, Budapest, what's the difference! 

[Eduard]

OK so it's Romania, frankly I read that post once and very quickly and in my mind it registered as Budapest (I'm doing 5 other things here and carefully studying I/O's posts is not high on my priority list). I was just making a  point that I/O might need to look at the atlas himself claiming Bucharest to be a Russian city.

[Eduard]

Eduard, you are just pathetic! How can anyone trust your knowledge and opinions (heaven forbid statistical data) if you have zero knowledge of the geography of the part of the world you are from and claim to have deep knowledge of? 

But anyways, your post made my day - so funny! 

where the funk did I ever claim that I have been to or have deep knowledge of Romania or Hungary or any other former Soviet Block country other than FSU???
Maybe in your distorted view they are "all the same" and one who was born in Russia is supposed to be intimately familiar with Romanian culture, language and traditions, but that's as ignorrant as assuming that every Irishman from Dublin must be intimately familiar with the culture, language and traditions of Palermo! After all they all come from "that other part of the world" cold "the West"

[I/O]

OK so it's Romania, frankly I read that post once and very quickly and in my mind it registered as Budapest (I'm doing 5 other things here and carefully studying I/O's posts is not high on my priority list). I was just making a  point that I/O might need to look at the atlas himself claiming Bucharest to be a Russian city.

Nobody claimed Bacharest to be a Russian or even FSU city. Eduard the POINT is, your attention to detail is severely lacking. I do hope you do better when translating for your clients than you have done reading here and with your statistics. Maybe a course in speed reading?

"that other part of the world" cold "the West"

Get the point?

I/O

[Lit_1nce]

An interesting thing to me, is that when I was a youngster (too long ago) I had heard that Australia was this mythical place of umpteen women to every guy.. of course now I know no such place really exists as dreamed of by guys looking for such a place.

Still.. Russia, and the FSU, must have a lot of what most people here are looking for, otherwise this would be one dead board to visit..

I guess it's all about expectations.. I'm sure there are a lot of great women there, but be realistic, the streets are not paved with blonds.

[Eduard]

Nobody claimed Bacharest to be a Russian or even FSU city. Eduard the POINT is, your attention to detail is severely lacking. I do hope you do better when translating for your clients than you have done reading here and with your statistics. Maybe a course in speed reading?
 Get the point?

I/O

The POINT is that I do care about my clients, they get my complete attention and a 100% dedication to their success. On the other hand I don't care about you, your opinions and what you perceive to be "the truth", therefore I scanned through your post briefly.
Your picking on my typo (cold verses called) is childish. yes like any human being I make mistakes when i type fast, so? I'd like to see you type a post in Russian and see how you do..your nasty attitude is pathetic.
Why don't you get a life? I thought you finally found a woman, so spend some time with her, that will be a lot more useful than writing this BS and wasting my time. I am ignoring you from now on.

[Bluebell]

Bucharest, Budapest, what's the difference! 

For you, obviously, no whatsoever difference. But for 10 million Hungarians who live in Hungary, and for another 5 million Hungarians who live outside the borders of Hungary, and especially for 1,5 million Hungarians living in Transylvania, which today belongs to Romania due to forced annexation after losing the WWI, there is a HUGE difference. Like saying, for example, what's the difference between Mexicans and Texans? 

If you want to offend any Hungarian, I repeat, any of them, it's enough to call him/her Romanian.

[Shadow]

In a word, Shadow...

NO.

In the term PM, P stands for Private or Personal...

Nuff' said.

Simoni in the field of diversion tactics calling out non-existing support in private is one of the things used to look better.
As BC said I do not have any desire to know the contents of PM's, however I just want to have the people that support Eduard to post in the open forum. I will not think any less of them for their support, just as I believe the Eduard can be an asset to the clients that choose him. While I might not agree with his self-image of being an all-knowing and all-powerful matchmaker, it does not mean that his basic service is worthless.

Perhaps Dan should charge the members that are here to promote their business some monthly fee... if we are going to listen to a commercial at least let it be a paid one. 

[Jet]

For you, obviously, no whatsoever difference...

If you want to offend any Hungarian, I repeat, any of them, it's enough to call him/her Romanian.

I understand Bluebell. I was only showing I/O how Eduard was confused with the idea that Bucharest was in Hungary 

[Jet]

The POINT is that I do care about my clients, they get my complete attention and a 100% dedication to their success. On the other hand I don't care about you, your opinions and what you perceive to be "the truth", therefore I scanned through your post briefly.

Eduard,
You are selling a service which most would agree, requires great attention to detail. You are trying to portray superior knowledge in a field that most potential clients know little about, themselves. You want them to trust your judgment in being able to deliver (forgive the pun) "the most bang for their buck". In order to pass yourself off as an authority, you have to, at a minimum, *appear* to be an authority. When dealing within a service industry, a prospective client's perception is everything. As I read through your posts here, I get the perception that I'd need your help, like fish need bicycles