What do you think about this fellow?

[KenC]

I believe most here would do stupid things just like these "weak men" if they were in the same circumstances.

Maxx

This is where you are totally wrong, Maxx.  In fact that is exactly the difference between the victims you speak of and the guys here with successful long term marriages.  The guys with successful marriages have a sense of self worth and would never tolerate such bad behavior from the women as you describe.
KenC

[Maxx2]

This is where you are totally wrong, Maxx.  In fact that is exactly the difference between the victims you speak of and the guys here with successful long term marriages.  The guys with successful marriages have a sense of self worth and would never tolerate such bad behavior from the women as you describe.
KenC

Ken, if you found out your wife was sending pornographic pictures of herself to other men what would you do?


Maxx

PS I know she wouldn't

[KenC]

Ken, if you found out your wife was sending pornographic pictures of herself to other men what would you do?


Maxx

PS I know she wouldn't

The marraige would be over immediately.
KenC

[AnastassiaAsh]

Hypothetically - what if she came to you and honestly confessed about that and said that she couldn't hide it anymore, that she wanted to stop, that she was very sorry and she would want you to forgive her, maybe not right away of course, but in time??? 

[KenC]

Hypothetically - what if she came to you and honestly confessed about that and said that she couldn't hide it anymore, that she wanted to stop, that she was very sorry and she would want you to forgive her, maybe not right away of course, but in time??? 

Anastassia,
I assume you are asking this of me?  I cannot realistically go into this hypothetical situation because there are many unknown facets to it.  But let me say this, I have been VERY clear on my outlook on infidelity with Lena.  Crystal clear.  In my world, there is no room for forgiveness in this area and no allowance for a mistake in judgement.  The line was clearly drawn in the sand and it is never to be crossed.  Period.  End of story.
KenC

[Maxx2]

The marraige would be over immediately.
KenC

How would you end the marriage? Would you call her out on this?


Maxx

[KenC]

How would you end the marriage? Would you call her out on this?


Maxx

Once the trust factor is breeched, there is very little of value left IMO.  I would never be with a woman I could not trust.  I would proceed in the manner that would best suit my interests. 
KenC

[Maxx2]

Once the trust factor is breeched, there is very little of value left IMO.  I would never be with a woman I could not trust.  I would proceed in the manner that would best suit my interests. 
KenC

I agree with you. Once trust is breached it is time to pack it in. What I would like to understand from you is what exactly would you do if you found those photos? Would you show them to her? Ask her to explain herself? Move out? Ask her to move out? I am looking for your action plan. Specifics. The reason I am asking is I am looking for feedback on an escape plan for those guys with GCG wives. Remember the VAWA ax that is hanging over your head. Her ability to self petition herself and all she needs for that is a little "official evidence of abuse". Also what would your exit plan be if you didn't know about this VAWA option for her? Would you confront her? "Kick her to the curb" (how?)   


Maxx

[KenC]

I agree with you. Once trust is breached it is time to pack it in. What I would like to understand from you is what exactly would you do if you found those photos? Would you show them to her? Ask her to explain herself? Move out? Ask her to move out? I am looking for your action plan. Specifics. The reason I am asking is I am looking for feedback on an escape plan for those guys with GCG wives. Remember the VAWA ax that is hanging over your head. Her ability to self petition herself and all she needs for that is a little "official evidence of abuse". Also what would your exit plan be if you didn't know about this VAWA option for her? Would you confront her? "Kick her to the curb" (how?)   


Maxx

I assume that you want to know how I would react if my wife had a pending GC?  if so, and knowing what I know now, I would consult with a divorce attorney and formulate a plan to protect myself.  If that would mean to live a charade with her for a little while, so be it.  The main goal would be to protect myself in any way possible.
KenC

[Maxx2]

I assume that you want to know how I would react if my wife had a pending GC?  if so, and knowing what I know now, I would consult with a divorce attorney and formulate a plan to protect myself.  If that would mean to live a charade with her for a little while, so be it.  The main goal would be to protect myself in any way possible.
KenC

Great answer Ken. It is the smart move. I always advise people who contact me to not confront their wives but to make a secret appointment with an immigration attorney and to document this. Then find out from that attorney what divorce attorney he would use if he was in a similar situation. Then go buy an Argyle sweater and play the best imitation of Mr Rogers you can until the divorce papers are served on her.   


Maxx

[KenC]

Great answer Ken. It is the smart move. I always advise people who contact me to not confront their wives but to make a secret appointment with an immigration attorney and to document this. Then find out from that attorney what divorce attorney he would use if he was in a similar situation. Then go buy an Argyle sweater and play the best imitation of Mr Rogers you can until the divorce papers are served on her.   


Maxx

Maxx,
I would try to document that she had never been abused yet and would also have a witness present from that point forward.  Even if it meant having another person move into the house.  Preferably a female as a woman's testimony would be more acceptable than another man's.

Just a note on this though.  As long as my interests were protected, I could care less if the future ex wife stayed in country or returned home.  That point is not relevant.
KenC

[Ronnie]

I assume the GC is still pending.  If she have been given one, the I-864 (affidavit of support) makes it very relevant whether she stays or leaves the country.

[KenC]

I understand that Ronnie.  That's what I said "As long as my interests were protected."
KenC

[Maxx2]

I assume the GC is still pending.  If she have been given one, the I-864 (affidavit of support) makes it very relevant whether she stays or leaves the country.

The I-864 is never enforced on a Federal or State level are far as collecting the costs from the USC of welfare benefits paid to a former immigrant spouse. It has been used in rare instances by hospital billing departments for bills run up the spouse. Also divorce attorneys use it as a lever in asking for spousal maintenance but usually that does not fly in most courts. Then there is the Stump decision which was a lawsuit brought on by a RW to make up the difference in her pay and what the Federal guidelines are for support (125% above the Federal poverty line). Most RW do not want to collect aid on a long term bases. To do so would limit their lifestyle. No fancy cars etc.

http://www.ilw.com/articles/2006,0110-wheeler.shtm


Maxx

[Ronnie]

When I first joined the RWG 5 years ago (before the Stump case) I was roasted for even bringing up the plain and serious language of the I-864.  "It won't happen" I was told.  "Nothing to get alarmed about."  They said.

To those who still feel that way, click Maxx's link to the case and read.

It's very sobering and no pre-nupt will have any effect on the requirement to maintain the immigrant for life if she remains an LPR and doesn't work.  Two things she can control entirely.

[Jet]

When I first joined the RWG 5 years ago (before the Stump case) I was roasted for even bringing up the plain and serious language of the I-864.  "It won't happen" I was told.  "Nothing to get alarmed about."  They said.

Ronnie, I recall that thread and remember we came to the conclusion that in certain circumstances a guy who married the wrong woman could quite literally be "on the hook" for the rest of his life, due to the language of the I-864; and the more I reviewed the text, the more I became convinced that your impression that the I-864 had much broader and more far reaching implications was the correct assessment. It is indeed a well crafted and scary piece of legislation.

[Ronnie]

Marrying the wrong woman a discernment that is aided with the passage of time.  Going slow through the process is a good idea.

Mistaken notions that the application for adjustment must be filed within so many days or months after marriage lead some to rush the process unnecessarily and perhaps unwisely. 

There is not time limit for filing for Adjustment as long as the marriage took place within the 90 days, in the case of the K-1.  The practical problems with waiting are that she can't get an EAD for work or and Driver license.  I our case we filed 15 months after marriage.

Now, what I wonder is this:  Can the signing of the I-864 be delayed until the interview?  I believe it can.  In the Stump case the court ruled that even though the wife had not yet become an LPR, the I-864 was signed and therefore binding.  That part of the ruling is weak because if the I-864 is a contract between the Gov't and the USC sponsor then it shouldn't be binding until the gov't grant's LPR status, prior to that, the government has not contractually met it's part of the bargain.  At least that's one way to look at it.  But if the affidavit signing can be delayed until the interview, it buys more time - the helpful ingredient in discerning the true nature of the woman who may have craftily hidden her true character.

Let's not forget that the nature of a socialist society is that you will be taken care of whether you work or not.  It's a terrible precedent the Congress has set but one that was done to allay the public concern that immigrants were sponsoring other immigrant family members, then letting welfare take care of them.  If the welfare agencies are not enforcing the contract, and it's only being used in situations like Stump, then the whole d*mn law needs to be repealed.

[Maxx2]

 I have talked with number of guys who have spent 100K or more in legal fees defending themselves. One guy that I know well spent between $400,000 to $500,000 defending himself. Then there are the six figure lawsuits and they are not uncommon from my observation. My lawyer told me that the ruling the judge used on me, "pushing and shoving" was for my protection. The reason being that the ruling meant it was mutual and it would be difficult for one party to sue the other. The other problem is court ordered spousal support on even very short term marriages. Sometimes for marriages that only lasted just a few months and the support that lasts a year or two. People thinking they are in the clear if they get a prenup, which usually does work, do not take in account all these other possibilities. The ultimate possibility being a prison term. I have seen several of those. You would think that a prison term would be based of a very serious assault with the wife having a stay in the hospital. Not so, just the authorities believing the story of the wife and deciding to carry out a no holds barred prosecution.    

These are the greater things to worry about and are much more likely to happen than the application of the I-864.  


Maxx

[Gator]

Ronnie,

I am joining this discussion late (yet have some idea of the content given my friendship with Maxx).

Your decision to delay filing for Adjustment of Status bewilders me.  My wife and I applied ASAP as I am committed to her goal to make America her new home (she has little fondness for Russia).  What did your wife think about this decision?

[Ronnie]

Gator,

My wife had a very hard time adjusting to America.  It's been 4 years now and she is still not an English speaker.  She failed her behind-the-wheel driving test yesterday in part because she had a hard time understanding the examiner's verbal directions (of course, were my wife from Latin America, the instructor would have communicated with her in Spanish.. no problemo).

At least twice a month for the first year she sat in tears wanting to go home.  Our newly constructed house was like a "prison" for her.  She depended on me to drive her everywhere and we were too far from the nearest shopping center to walk.  There was no public transportation.   

I stopped posting on RWG because I didn't know what to say...today things are going well - Next day not so much.  Also we were living in Arizona at that time and the AOS was a three year wait period for an interview.  Since she didn't like AZ and wanted to move to California, I saw no reason to file in AZ.  I also was mindful of the fact that I really didn't know her that well despite our living together in Dnepr for 4 months while we waited on the K-1 to come through.

Adding to my concern was the fact that I was divorced from women I thought I knew well...21 and 9 years of marriage respectively.  Both revealed themselves to be other than the women I thought I knew when the money issues of the divorce were placed before them.  Why would a FSUW be any different? 

Despite her failing the driving test, she was not discouraged.  I was surprised and impressed with her emotional reaction..."when can I try again?"  In fact, that attitude kind of sums up her life and why I think I decided I could do well with this woman.

[Maxx2]

Sorry to hear Ronnie how difficult your wife's adjustment has been. Now I understand why you disappeared. It's painful to be on board and not be able to contribute to the happy uplifting subjects. Worse is the knowledge that it is probable that one will have to make the sad announcement that it didn't work out. But Ronnie it seems your lady is strong and has the grit to stick it out until she adapts. Getting that license will make all the difference. Has she gone back to Russia for visits? This might make it worse I would imagine.


Maxx

[William3rd]

Practice pointer- the DELAY in filing AOS is a factor that can be considered in a subsequent VAWA filing because the whole point of VAWA is the control aspect of the abuser.

Since the USC petitioner is not consulted in the I360 filing, the USCIS reviewer would be spared the amazing explanations that the USCs frequently come up with as to their failure to do what they are obligated to do. . .

[BC]

Sorry to hear Ronnie how difficult your wife's adjustment has been.

As far as adjustment issues go, Ronnie's experience seems well within the norm IMHO.

I have adjusted myself to life in several different countries and did not consider myself 'adjusted' until many years had passed.  The fact that even under difficult circumstances their relationship is holding up says a lot.

Our most difficult period was between 2 and 3 years. I think this is where our true relationship began to form.

Don't count chickens before they hatch..

[Ronnie]

Matthew Bender, Immigration Law and Practice suggests couples might consider the delay so as to avoid the 2 year conditional GC.  We did in fact avoid that inconvenience and expense.

There have never been any worries over VAWA in our case. 
VAWA and I-864 are two different, yet related concerns for men.  Maxx2 believes the I-864 is a lesser concern than VAWA.  I would point out that for VAWA to be a concern where them man were not an actual abuser, the alien would have to falsify claims and charges.  My wife is guided by her faith and would consider herself unworthy of any place in her heaven if she made such false witness.  I'm confortable with that.

However, under the provisions of the I-864 any alien would be perfectly within her legal rights and would not have to make any false charges to sue him for lifetime support at the rate of 125% of the poverty level.  In case one thinks that such a life is not tempting, consider than many American seniors live on less.  I know of one (MOB from the UK) now US GC holder who lives on her ex's 125% support based on her right to sue under I-864

[groovlstk]

Also what should be taken in account with these guys is that a situation like they experience really scrambles their brains. It did mine ( I hope I have recovered... ). I liken these times like the first 25 minutes of Saving Private Ryan. I think of that scene where Tom Hanks is sitting on the beach stunned. Blood in the water. Blood and water running down his face after he puts his helmut one. Someone shouts at him. He shakes his shock off and proceeds up the hill. I see almost no one going through times with perfect moves. I believe most here would do stupid things just like these "weak men" if they were in the same circumstances.

Maxx
 

Maxx, I think the behavior of a guy who proposes to a beautiful FSU woman without bothering to get to know her first and the subsequent "deer in headlights" behavior when he finds out she's using him are directly related.

I'm not so foolish to think that such a thing could never happen to me, but of the dozens of stories I've read about GC scammers I have yet to read about a situation where a couple had a seemingly solid marriage and the guy woke up one morning completely surprised to find himself in a trainwreck. Always there are big red flags... no sex for 6 months, little or no affection during courtship and after, going out evenings with single friends, mysterious phone calls, etc.

It's entirely likely that if I found myself facing false DV charges I might be shocked to the point of inaction. But I can also tell you this: I wouldn't marry a stranger, I wouldn't tolerate my wife going out to clubs with her friends while I remained home, and I sure as hell wouldn't remain in a relationship in which there was no mutual affection. I'm far, far from perfect and sometimes I can't imagine how my wife puts up with me, but I have enough self-respect to demand more. Some of these guys whose stories you tell here seem to be content with a pretty woman on their arm and nothing more fulfilling beyond that. Don't you think there is major significance to such common threads in these stories?