Realities of FSUW

[JR]

Consensus #2: because of historical/cultural realities most FSUW consider lying and deceit to be normal and acceptable in order to advance their own interests or agenda...

I can say unequivocally that this was true with my Russian wife of ten years. She had absolutely no qualms about lying if she thought it would bring her gain. She gave piano lessons in our home. In our community there were a lot of Jewish people. When it suited her purpose she would tell people that her mother was Jewish. When they were gone she would badmouth Jews with such things I will not repeat here. When I would confront her with this she looked at me like I was an idiot and ask what I was talking about. To her it was perfectly normal to apply situational ethics.

[Zhena]

You know,gentlemen,of course I didnt mean that most of the women are the golddiggers.
Dont worry,the women marry the poor and middle-class men constantly.
But to blame the women that they like rich men-same as blame the men that they like beautiful women. It is natural. Its a natural selection. Richier man= better life=better father for her children. Period. They (women) feel more secure.

[Faux Pas]

"Why it so interesting to you?  It just escalator..."  'Yes but it is an escalator that is like a ten story building.. you will not see that in many other places in the world..'  "yes, but escalator is stupid.. it just a machine" 'true, but I like it.. I want to make a movie about it'  "it will to be very strange movie, you a little strange Ereek" 'hahah yes I am a little strange.. but its ok because you are not normal' "ok, it true hahaha" 

Now there's the all-time understatement on the forum 

[JR]

What seems common of women worldwide is they are most attracted to power and money. You will find, in general, that the most powerful and rich guys seem to have the best looking women, don't they? Why would an RW or UW be any different? She will compare her life to that of her friends lives. She will not want to be at the bottom of the social level. Women are competitive in that way. She will push you to earn more...better job, nicer things. The younger she is the more she will want.

I found this to be true in my wife also. She lusted after the things others had. It tormented her to not be on the same 'level' as many of the parents of the students she taught. We owned a nice home in a decent neighborhood of Southern California, owned two newer vehicles, she had mink coats, a diamond Rolex watch, many other items of jewelry, a six foot grand piano, etc, etc. Yet one night towards the end of our eight or ninth year of marriage I came into the bedroom to see her sitting no our bed, her legs crossed, head hung down in her lap and a loaded gun in her hand. When I approached her she looked up at me and said "We are shit, lets kill ourselves."

[JR]

You know,gentlemen,of course I didnt mean that most of the women are the golddiggers.
Dont worry,the women marry the poor and middle-class men constantly.
But to blame the women that they like rich men-same as blame the men that they like beautiful women. It is natural. Its a natural selection. Richier man= better life=better father for her children. Period. They (women) feel more secure.

Very true...I can't understand why people have to bash a woman for wanting a man who can provide for a family. It is her main drive in life and she has every right to seek out a man whom she feels can best provide for the family she desires.

Disclaimer: This is a generality, only a generality and nothing but a generality.

[Misha]

But to blame the women that they like rich men-same as blame the men that they like beautiful women. It is natural. Its a natural selection. Richier man= better life=better father for her children. Period. They (women) feel more secure.

So, should a man divorce his wife as soon as he finds a more beautiful woman? Dump her after the first wrinkle? If a woman wants to marry a richer man, she should should continue looking, and should not get married. Once she has made her choice, she should stop looking IMHO, as should he.

[JR]

Many men, especially the rich ones do dump a woman at the first sign of a wrinkle, or the first few extra pounds. Heck, some men trade women in like they're on a two year lease program

[OlgaH]

Richier man= better life=better father for her children. Period. They (women) feel more secure.

When I was working at a summer camp for children there was a teacher who always was telling us how her husband-businessman was making a lot of money and buying expensive things for her and their son. Some of the teachers knew her family well and knew that while she was working at the summer camp, he had his vacation with his next young beautiful lover at the resort in Turkey. Two his lovers had mink coats from him as presents, but his wife never had one. What so interesting she also knew about his lovers. Did she feel secure?   I think not enough to leave him, and preferred to have such a miserable life to divorce.    

[JR]

Perhaps she wasn't miserable...only she knows Perhaps his mistresses made her feel secure.

[Ronnie]

I found this to be true in my wife also. She lusted after the things others had. It tormented her to not be on the same 'level' as many of the parents of the students she taught. We owned a nice home in a decent neighborhood of Southern California, owned two newer vehicles, she had mink coats, a diamond Rolex watch, many other items of jewelry, a six foot grand piano, etc, etc. Yet one night towards the end of our eight or ninth year of marriage I came into the bedroom to see her sitting no our bed, her legs crossed, head hung down in her lap and a loaded gun in her hand. When I approached her she looked up at me and said "We are *snip*, lets kill ourselves."

If you told me that this was an American wife, I would say she was obviously ill.  Since she was Russian, it's hard to say if it was illness or just her culture.

[Ade]

I have to shake my head at some of the generalizations being posted. Maybe some of you guys are attracted to the wrong type of women or aren't astute enough to avoid the morally bankrupt ones? Maybe it's the nature of the game and it's just that there are disproportionate numbers of morally questionable women looking to "trade up" when they look for an international relationship? Whatever, I do know that the people I've met in the FSU don't seem to be anything like I've seen described by some here and my fiancée certainly isn't at all like that.

FWIW, in my opinion, anyone that knowingly marries someone that lies without conscience and that values material things above all else is a fool and their future is probably not going to be very pleasant.

And before any of you start, I'm not for a moment implying that any of you here knowingly married someone like that.

[Zhena]

When I was working at a summer camp for children there was a teacher who always was telling us how her husband-businessman was making a lot of money and buying expensive things for her and their son. Some of the teachers knew her family well and knew that while she was working at the summer camp, he had his vacation with his next young beautiful lover at the resort in Turkey. Two his lovers had mink coats from him as presents, but his wife never had one. What so interesting she also knew about his lovers. Did she feel secure?   I think not enough to leave him, and preferred to have such a miserable life to divorce.    

Very typical situation for FSU,where the very rich men have a huge choice and women literally jump on them. Many of them have some mistresses and a wife knows that-but prefers to stay in the marriage cos she knows she willl not get much after divorce.You know a story about Abramovich though-his wife divorced him only because it was in UK and the laws working there. I dont think she would divorce him in Russia.
To Misha-yes,if for example,the slender woman who the man married some years ago,turnes into a mount of fat and doesnt show any desire to change-many men will be very disappointed and probably will start to look at other women.

[Zhena]

my fiancée certainly isn't at all like that.

"Never say never".
You can find out only in certain circumstances.

[Ronnie]

"Never say never".
You can find out only in certain circumstances.

One never knows who their fiancee is.  One seldom knows who his/her spouse is until several decades have passed.  Then, there might be a good idea (only).  This is based on the premise that most people don't know ourselves as well as we think we do. 

[Vaughn]

.... and that values material things above all else...

SJ, can you elaborate on that part?

[Ade]

"Never say never".
You can find out only in certain circumstances.

  People can change I will give you that but I think I'm astute enough to have figured out her current core values after living with her here and there for almost 6 months, from knowing her history, from seeing how she behaves with her family and her friends, her attitude towards money, materialism, and her views on pretentious people. Even from the discussions we've had when viewing this forum together have shown me nothing of the negative qualities that are discussed here so often. 

I honestly think that there tends to be a skewed view on the women in the MOB industry mainly because it does attract a disproportionate number of morally bankrupt women intent on trading up. I think you'll find that most normal, everyday FSU women that wouldn't normally consider dating internationally aren't like that at all. It's one reason I would never use an agency or a tour; they attract too many of the wrong type of women. My fiancée would never use one and has a similar views of agencies and tours as most FSUW. 

[Ade]

One never knows who their fiancee is.  One seldom knows who his/her spouse is until several decades have passed.  Then, there might be a good idea (only).  This is based on the premise that most people don't know ourselves as well as we think we do. 

I'm sorry, but after several decades your wife will be a different person to the one you married.

I've found over the years that few people are introspective or objective enough to understand themselves or others. Fortunately, I don't count myself among them.

[Ade]

SJ, can you elaborate on that part?

Um, I'm not sure if you are joking here? Does that statement really need to be elaborated on?

[Zhena]

Though,I can teach you guys,how to make your wife so happy that she will think you re the best man in the world-even if you re not really rich.
First of all-your good attitude,you shouldnt yell at her at any circumstances and shouldnt criticise her. Show your love and appreciation instead.
Second,SPOIL her sometimes-find out what is that toy she is crazy about-and buy it to her,make her surprise. Even if its expensive and you really dont understand how is it possible to spend so much money on that crap. Buy it to her-she will be happy and proud. And she wont look at other men then,if she is in her clear mind.

[Zhena]

Seroiusly Jaded,do you mean that your income is not important to your fiancee? Or she is completely satisfied with that. Very possible. But lets imagine what happens if you lose your job-and cant find anything decent for a year...even more...happens,the crisis now. What will she do? And are you sure that she will do exactly that?
 I believe in love,I am not cynical. But also I saw many times how the financial difficulties ruined the families.
Here even not the matter of money maybe-she may earn pretty much herself-but the woman wants to respect her man and be proud of him.

[Vaughn]

Um, I'm not sure if you are joking here? Does that statement really need to be elaborated on?

No joke at all. I was assuming you'd stop short and fail to explain. I've a strong feeling that the
number of women who actually place material gain above all else is quite minimal. Now, if we are
talking about women who appreciate improvements in their married lives - and are willing to
contribute to those gains, I think you'll find they far exceed the former in numbers, whether
they be morally bankrupt agency ladies - or not.

What my wife deems morally bankrupt is complacency. There's quite a difference between gain
and material worship.

[Ade]

Seroiusly Jaded,do you mean that your income is not important to your fiancee? Or she is completely satisfied with that. Very possible. But lets imagine what happens if you lose your job-and cant find anything decent for a year...even more...happens,the crisis now. What will she do? And are you sure that she will do exactly that?
 I believe in love,I am not cynical. But also I saw many times how the financial difficulties ruined the families.
Here even not the matter of money maybe-she may earn pretty much herself-but the woman wants to respect her man and be proud of him.

My fiancée wasn't at all interested in what my income was and it's not important to her as long as we can eat and have a roof over our heads and from the way she behaves I totally believe this. If I lose my job and can't work, there will always be a roof and food - I live in a social welfare state after all - so what's there to worry about? She's not materialistic so she won't be losing all the shoes, handbags, make up that she doesn't buy already. She makes all her own clothes as she's a designer and seamstress and a good one at that, so there's always income there; we're a partnership after all. 

I think that a lot of marriages which fail when financial problems hit are not directly related to the the lack of spending power but because of the personality changes that the financial stress causes. People become argumentative, bitter and nasty and it is this that impacts on the relationship. But, I learned a long time ago that once you have enough to satisfy the basics necessities, any extra money is just icing on the cake and doesn't truly add to long term happiness; family, friends and loved ones, now they do and it's they that matter.

My fiancée has a friend married to a German artist type; he's broke now and was when they were married; they live in his parents house. She's happy and so is he by all accounts. Not everyone needs money and material things, as long as they can eat and have the basics and most importantly, someone to love and share their life, it's good enough.

No joke at all. I was assuming you'd stop short and fail to explain. I've a strong feeling that the number of women who actually place material gain above all else is quite minimal. Now, if we are talking about women who appreciate improvements in their married lives - and are willing to contribute to those gains, I think you'll find they far exceed the former in numbers, whether they be morally bankrupt agency ladies - or not.

What my wife deems morally bankrupt is complacency. There's quite a difference between gain and material worship.

Vaughn, by "above all else" I mean that they value money and material things above their relationship with their husband. To me this is moral bankruptcy.

Oh, and yes, I'd agree that in the general population there aren't that many mercenary women but how about in the agency and tour industry? I'd bet the percentage of women there out to primarily better their financial situation and life style above all else is much, much higher than the general population.

[Ade]

Here even not the matter of money maybe-she may earn pretty much herself-but the woman wants to respect her man and be proud of him.

BTW, if a woman's respect is derived from how much you earn and how much you possess rather than who you are then I would say that this is the sort of woman I'd not want to be around.

[goforit]

I found this to be true in my wife also. She lusted after the things others had. It tormented her to not be on the same 'level' as many of the parents of the students she taught. We owned a nice home in a decent neighborhood of Southern California, owned two newer vehicles, she had mink coats, a diamond Rolex watch, many other items of jewelry, a six foot grand piano, etc, etc. Yet one night towards the end of our eight or ninth year of marriage I came into the bedroom to see her sitting no our bed, her legs crossed, head hung down in her lap and a loaded gun in her hand. When I approached her she looked up at me and said "We are *snip*, lets kill ourselves."

For sheer drama, I don't think I have been on a more interesting forum.

[Misha]

Many men, especially the rich ones do dump a woman at the first sign of a wrinkle, or the first few extra pounds. Heck, some men trade women in like they're on a two year lease program

I don't have much respect for such men either  They should not be getting married either IMHO.