Realities of FSUW

[Misha]

Reading between the lines is okay if you get it right, but if the person whose lines you are reading between keeps telling you that you are getting it wrong, but you persist anyway, then the problem is not them and what they said, but you and what you keep trying to make them say.

Fine, if you don't agree with my interpretation, that is okay with me. However, IMHO, the reason why there are so many trainwrecks is that men overlook the obvious. Read ScottinCrimea's thread as an example.

[Misha]

so to not get divorced man has to work 4 jobs and buy her a new car.

Or, you can marry a woman who loves you and would not want you to drive yourself to an early grave through working four jobs 

[JR]

Help me here. Which of the women involved in this thread has said that all or even most Russian women are only interested in a man's money? I must be missing something?

The other evening I was talking to a Russian woman on the phone and the first question she asked me was "Why you want a Russian woman? They all bad." So of course I asked her if she was bad. She didn't answer

[Ronnie]

The other evening I was talking to a Russian woman on the phone and the first question she asked me was "Why you want a Russian woman? They all bad." So of course I asked her if she was bad. She didn't answer

They know each other best, don't they?  I had a somewhat similar experience during the first year of my many visits to FSU.  I was in Costco one evening, when I overheard a couple speaking Russian to each other.  Wanting to practice my Russian, I struck up a conversation with them by asking where they were from.  They in turn, asked where I was from, believing perhaps I was a Russian or Ukrainian man with bad grammar (not uncommon, BTW).  I told them I was American and they asked how it was I spoke Russian. 

When I explained that I had visited the FSU several times and was interested in finding a mate there, the wife blurted out, "Ani vse artisti" (They're all artists).  "Artisti?" I asked looking puzzled by the translation of the word.  "Actresses!" the lady clarified.

I told her that I had already learned that what she was saying was mostly true but that I was looking for the exceptional lady.  She just shook her head and wished me success.

I reflect back on that experience 7 years ago and compare it with my own real experiences.  After all, this thread is entitled "realities of FSUW."  The lady was definitely wrong, as anyone can see who follows this forum.  Blues Fairy and a very few others here prove there are exceptions, just as I thought there were.  In those two years I met and dated just over forty FSUW.  I must tell you in all honesty, and I wish I could say otherwise, but I found only 3 or 4, less than 10% who were exceptions to the assertion made by the RW in the store.

Perhaps another topic about western men could be started that would confirm or deny the common perceptions or misperceptions of the men seeking FSU wives, I've met many of those too, both there and here.  Yes, there are the sex tourists..maybe about 10%, Yes there are the social misfits, maybe another 10%, but the vast majority are pretty darned average, just looking for a good woman of character who is looking for a good man of character.

If you men have not yet made a decision and are still seeking/selecting, be heartened by what you see and hear on this forum and learn lessons here as well so that you won't have to learn them the hard way as many have done. 

These waters are shark-infested...swimming is not advised, but if you must swim..be extra careful. 

[Zhena]

My idea of marriage?  A lifelong project in a team with a person perfectly interesting and entirely loved for what he is, not what he has to give.  Giving/taking is not the objective, it's the collateral of and means to achieving mutual goals.  

My husband is terrible at giving presents and he does not make all that much money, though provides adequately for our necessities.  My standard of living in Moscow was definitely higher than here (though when I go back to work I hope to raise it somewhat).  I definitely do not view my man through the prism of his giving capabilities and I'm the happier for it.  Can't even imagine leaving him for someone richer.  

Very good. Your husband is not hopeless. You can teach him to give the presents
If you imagine me as some evil parasite who takes and takes only,you re wrong I am in the same situation as you are,sitting with a toddler and will go to work as soon as I can.
The mutual giving I consider to be the best model,everybody is satisfied. If one side is not satisfied-there will be the problem early or late. If you give more than you get-you will feel withdrown after some time. So if both sides give to each other,noone feels neglected. Thats my point. You knew your husbands income before you married him,so there is no problem. You will help when you ll start working.

[Zhena]

A very nice post Zhena. It says a lot about you  

which one exactly?

[Zhena]

Love? Because she has found the man that she wants as a life partner?

Misha,stop playing teenager.
Family is something that based on many things,not ONLY love. It is a huge responsibility,ok? Especially when you have the kids. Dont you feel responsible to provide the decent life for your wife and kids? Especially when they love yu so much? This is what turns me off,Misha. I consider this as irresponsibility-not trying hard,but "love me as I am". The castle from a sand. Be more practical.

[Zhena]

Or, you can marry a woman who loves you and would not want you to drive yourself to an early grave through working four jobs 

yes,better drive your woman in the early grave(who loves you!)
you selfish ,Misha,that is your problem. Find 1 job,but decent,noone asks to do 4.

[Ade]

My idea of marriage?  A lifelong project in a team with a person perfectly interesting and entirely loved for what he is, not what he has to give.  Giving/taking is not the objective, it's the collateral of and means to achieving mutual goals.  

My husband is terrible at giving presents and he does not make all that much money, though provides adequately for our necessities.  My standard of living in Moscow was definitely higher than here (though when I go back to work I hope to raise it somewhat).  I definitely do not view my man through the prism of his giving capabilities and I'm the happier for it.  Can't even imagine leaving him for someone richer.  

Thank you for confirming that not all FSUW prioritize money in a relationship.

[Zhena]

Ronnie,the russian couples here dont like those who married to americnas. They consider them MOB.
And dont put an example of those "good" women. I know some in real too,they are not happy. Their husbands? Maybe happy as they got a good deal. Will those marriages last long? I doubt unless the woman is masohistic there. As I said,if you dont get as much as you gave-you ll feel withdrown. Once then,the problems will arise. What I can see from Mishas and some others like him posts,that he doesnt want to take much tension on himself. He wants to enjoy life and have a woman,who will be happy only cos she sees him,so intelligent and irresistible man. Good idea but unfortunately doesnt work for long with normal women. There are some exceptional women with low self-esteem,with whom this will work probably. Your goal-find such a woman,the waters full or sharks Suddenly you may find out that she loves not you only,but herself too.

[Ade]

You don't have to do such a thing. Since this is a discussion forum and you are making a pretty strong statement I wanted to see what evidence you had since I myself didn't see it in the thread, and the quote you provided didn't back up your statement that it had been stated in this thread by Zhenna that all RW or even most RW are only interested in money.

Since that seems difficult for you to provide, I'm going to assume such a statement has not been made, and that this is an uncalled for characterization by you. I would be happy to be corrected since I really don't have a dog in this fight, so feel free to do so if you have something a little stronger than what you provided in a previous post.

Yes, you're right, no one has said that it's only about money but in some women's posts here there's certainly enough to indicate that a significant part of their decision making process involves material aspects of a relationship.

Take a look at this quote;

Seroiusly Jaded,do you mean that your income is not important to your fiancee? Or she is completely satisfied with that. Very possible. But lets imagine what happens if you lose your job-and cant find anything decent for a year...even more...happens,the crisis now. What will she do? And are you sure that she will do exactly that?
 I believe in love,I am not cynical. But also I saw many times how the financial difficulties ruined the families.
Here even not the matter of money maybe-she may earn pretty much herself-but the woman wants to respect her man and be proud of him.

As far as I can tell by this her husband better watch out if he becomes unemployed as she may up and leave him for someone with more money. I have great faith that the woman I'm about to marry would heap scorn on anyone with such ideas as Zhena's. BF said it far more eloquently than I ever could.

But FWIW, I can see that a woman would not go out of their way initially to search for a man that is obviously destitute. I think that goes without saying. Of course, it's been known that a woman will bump into a man like this and fall in love regardless. Other than that, if a couple truly loves each other, money and "things" are meaningless additions and should not add to the love they share.

[Zhena]

You re flying very high in the sky,Jaded. Be more down to earth. Material aspect not involved only if the people too young and romantic or either too naive. We live in material world,not in the paradise. You claim that you re very mature-at this point I wouldnt say so. If you want to be like Diogen-better dont marry.

[Ade]

I reflect back on that experience 7 years ago and compare it with my own real experiences.  After all, this thread is entitled "realities of FSUW."  The lady was definitely wrong, as anyone can see who follows this forum.  Blues Fairy and a very few others here prove there are exceptions, just as I thought there were.  In those two years I met and dated just over forty FSUW.  I must tell you in all honesty, and I wish I could say otherwise, but I found only 3 or 4, less than 10% who were exceptions to the assertion made by the RW in the store.

And how did you come to meet these women exactly?

My guess is that you've been exposed to the skewed sample effect of the MOB industry.

[Ade]

You re flying very high in the sky,Jaded. Be more down to earth. Material aspect not involved only if the people too young and romantic or either too naive. We live in material world,not in the paradise. You claim that you re very mature-at this point I wouldnt say so. If you want to be like Diogen-better dont marry.

It's a material world yes, but maybe, just maybe, you don't realize how much of that actually needs to impact on a relationship. It may sound overly romantic in this cynical world but really, if you meet the right person, money matters not one whit; I know it, I've seen it and I've experienced it. I can only think that you haven't yet and I pity you that wake up call.

[Aloe]

I see the relationship as the mutual giving. And I dont mind to give my husband a present,which,I know,he will like. It makes me happy to give to him,ok-so very natural that I expect the same attitude and dont understand different.

You speak of mutual giving, and the next sentence you define the meaning of it as giving material things. Question is, why giving in your understanding is giving presents only? I'd be very disappointed if my fiance gave me those louis vuitton shoes, i've been drooling over, because they cost more than he makes in a month and that's just silly to blow all that money on shoes when there are many other things we need. And frankly spending that much money without talking to me isn't very pleasant find either. Giving isn't about material things. It's giving your love, care and attention. There is nothing wrong with giving gifts, as long as you can afford them, but if not, it doesn't mean the woman is gonna be terminally unhappy, unless presents is all she wants. A simple note left for me on the fridge when i wake up, saying that he loves me, would as much light up my day as any gift he can afford. I could have married a richer guy, but i couldn't be happy with someone who i don't love, and no amount of ferraris and castles in france would change that, i would feel very lonely and unhappy being married like that, but that's just me.
By the way, Abramovich's wife divorced him in a russian court where british laws don't work, unlike you previously stated. I don't follow gossip, but it was all over the news, hard to miss.

[Aloe]

I am not talking about being able to communicate. Language can do that, that is why I am so adamant about not getting involved with anyone who doesn't speak English, what kind of relationship can you have?
I am talking about understanding why my Ex-wife always refused to walk in front of my hotel. I had to meet her in the Metro station. She explained it to me but I could only understand it at the surface level. I had not lived the experiences which led her to believe that her picture would be taken and there would be trouble for her family. As an American I cannot fathom that. I can go along with it but to be driven by that kind of fear, no I cannot walk in her shoes.

maybe she was scared to be mistaken for a hooker?

[Aloe]

(I've just read the thread- find it funny that Misha is attacking Zhena for the same thing he attacked me not so long ago- I said that RW first of all want the men who make decent money. Ah, ah, Doll, your husband is a big bucks guy so there is no love in your marriage.
 So I do agree with Zhena - women look for a better life. "Better" is not the cheapest food and second hand stores.

Both men and women look for a better life via marriage. Better because you will have someone you love and who loves you, better becayse you find your closest friend and partner who you can always rely on, better because you won't be lonely anymore, better because a million reasons, so it goes both ways. For some women to make their life better with LOVE is a bigger preference than to make it better by getting more money.

[Aloe]

However, if you have a child(ren) then it probably makes a huge difference, and you think of them first, that's the kind of woman i see marrying without love, just to give their children a better future, then you give a lot of importance to guys incomes and etc, for the sake of your children

[Aloe]

all that being said, you have to not lose your common sense, and it's probably isn't the smartest thing for an obese trucker joe who recently marked his 50th birthday to write a 20 yr old hottie, hoping she will fall in love with him. I'm exaggerrating, but you get my point, i'm saying this because it wasn't uncommon for me to get letters from such people. But that's more to the topic of love. I'm not saying it's impossible for a 20 yr old hottie to fall for joe, but the chances are minimal. I even once got a letter plainly and simply offering an exchange: my body for 3 years, for a green card, now that's just sick 

[Zhena]

I guess before to say something,we should make some survey-the age,the marital status for today(and for how many years) and the presence of the kids.
Aloe,no,giving is NOT about the gifts only and of course,if he cant afford something,its silly to expect.that..But if he can and he knows I want it and will like it-why not? I only welcome that. Dont prevent a man from being a man. If he cant afford-there are other ways like the breakfasts in the bed etc. And some little things wgich is not expensive but show he cares. My husband gave me a stuffed rabbit once in the morning It was very touching,I was pregnant and he said I look same puffy as this "krolik" Is that something difficult to do?.. All those things make a life brighter. I give him both,material and nonmaterial gifts.

[Aloe]

I guess before to say something,we should make some survey-the age,the marital status for today(and for how many years) and the presence of the kids.
Aloe,no,giving is NOT about the gifts only and of course,if he cant afford something,its silly to expect.that..But if he can and he knows I want it and will like it-why not? I only welcome that. Dont prevent a man from being a man. If he cant afford-there are other ways like the breakfasts in the bed etc. And some little things wgich is not expensive but show he cares. My husband gave me a stuffed rabbit once in the morning It was very touching,I was pregnant and he said I look same puffy as this "krolik" Is that something difficult to do?.. All those things make a life brighter. I give him both,material and nonmaterial gifts.

well you should have said that in the beginning, then this topic would be twice shorter

[remiel6]

I love making breakfast in bed,  :)and giving attention like this.  ;)It was the buy me a new car because my friend has one that I was referring to. I would hope I would never lose the love of making breakfast in bed, or buying flowers, or stuffed rabbits. These things are not a problem. I am happy so many of you have found a partner you are happy with. Me, well i am not a fifty year old trucker, some of whom make good money I might add. I would just want to marry someone who loves me for me, and know that the whole sickness and health part of a wedding vow meant something. To me, who has never been married, if I make the commitment to marry I mean it, and the example given was of a girl who divorced because she did not get a new car.

[Doll]

Both men and women look for a better life via marriage

By this I only mean material things. Not all the women look for a higher level of life- they have it in Russia (Ukraine, etc.) but those are definitely not seeking for the worse life style.
Overall- yes, love IS important but there IS no love at the point a woman is creating her profile online. She is starting looking for a successfulman.
A successful man is his career, not so? If he is in his 30s, 40's and 50's and is not successful financially then we need to think twice.

[Doll]

A simple note left for me on the fridge when i wake up, saying that he loves me, would as much light up my day as any gift he can afford. 

It is not typical for men- would be nice but it not typical.

[Doll]

well you should have said that in the beginning, then this topic would be twice shorter Cheesy

Come on, you knew that.We can forgive the AM who take the words literary but you did know that.