Boston marathon bombers are Chechens?

[mendeleyev]

True, how to you spell Afghanistan for starters?

[GQBlues]

Conspiracy theorists, LOL. CG understands full well what I think of 9/11. We've had this discussion on the other board a long time ago...CG have his views and reasons and I have mine...

But to not automatically flow with mainstream media reporting about this latest event does NOT make an individual a conspiracy theorist. Have we not learned anything from Benghazi?

Is the guy they killed last night one of the bomber? Is that guy they apprehended just now the bomber? Are they guilty of the Boston bombing right here and now? If so, I ask how the heck do any of you know that as a matter of fact?

[Kokopelli]

We don't know if this had anything to do with Islam, GOB.

Two houses in Islam; spiritual and political.
This was the political side.

[CanadaMan]

Is the guy they killed last night one of the bomber? Is that guy they apprehended just now the bomber? Are they guilty of the Boston bombing right here and now? If so, I ask how the heck do any of you know that as a matter of fact?

Look. If the Boston Police Dept. declares in a Tweet:  "CAPTURED!!! The hunt is over. The search is done. The terror is over. And justice has won. Suspect in custody.
   8:58 PM - 19 Apr 2013 "

We must know, for a fact, beyond any reasonable doubt, that they have the bomber. Case closed!

The same as when they got that authentic tape of Bin Laden declaring his guilt in 911. It was case closed then for him too.

   

[BillyB]

I await your response.

You can relax now. It's over. Celebrate!

It's too bad Billy that you couldn't see my tongue planted firmly in my cheek on that one.   
You didn't notice my smiley?

I seen your smilely and I thought I injected enough sarcasm in that post nobody would think I was serious.

Is the guy they killed last night one of the bomber? Is that guy they apprehended just now the bomber? Are they guilty of the Boston bombing right here and now? If so, I ask how the heck do any of you know that as a matter of fact?

I guess we gotta let the suspect go. Might as well let everyone out of prison while we're at it. They're all innocent, just ask them.


GQ, do you understand how silly you sound? If you were the Mayor or chief of police of Boston, governor of Massachusetts, President of the USA, head of FBI, or any position of authority and asked those questions on live tv tonight, you might be thrown in the slammer too. Hope you don't have plans to get into law enforcement or public office.

[GQBlues]

You can relax now. It's over. Celebrate!

Yup! Just as I thought. Empty banter. I guess you couldn't find that quote you accused me of, right? LOL.

...I guess we gotta let the suspect go. Might as well let everyone out of prison while we're at it. They're all innocent, just ask them. ...

More noise. But here's real doozy for you...do you happen to know how many convicted prisoners that had been let go because of DNA evidences revealed they were in fact innocent?

...Since 1989, there have been tens of thousands of cases where prime suspects were identified and pursued—until DNA testing (prior to conviction) proved that they were wrongly accused.

http://www.innocenceproject.org/Content/Facts_on_PostConviction_DNA_Exonerations.php



Unlike you, I don't rush to judgment simply because I heard it on the news. So, you don't need to play dumb. It comes naturally for you.

...GQ, do you understand how silly you sound? If you were the Mayor or chief of police of Boston, governor of Massachusetts, President of the USA, head of FBI, or any position of authority and asked those questions on live tv tonight, you might be thrown in the slammer too. Hope you don't have plans to get into law enforcement or public office.

"... In more than 25 percent of cases in a National Institute of Justice study, suspects were excluded once DNA testing was conducted during the criminal investigation (the study, conducted in 1995, included 10,060 cases where testing was performed by FBI labs).



Filter...noise.

[BillyB]

do you happen to know how many convicted prisoners that had been let go because of DNA evidences revealed they were in fact innocent?

You seem upset about the suspect being caught tonight as if an injustice has been done. If you don't feel like celebrating his capture, can you at least give a little praise for the cops since they didn't kill him?

[GQBlues]

You seem upset about the suspect being caught tonight as if an injustice has been done. If you don't feel like celebrating his capture, can you at least give a little praise for the cops since they didn't kill him?

If you can't dazzle them with your brilliance, baffle them with your BS. Still firing blanks, I see.

[Cameraguy]

Conspiracy theorists, LOL. CG understands full well what I think of 9/11. We've had this discussion on the other board a long time ago...

Yeah, but I like you anyway, GQ. BillyB too. 

I hate to see this thread devolve into pettiness and bickering.

And Billy, I do give the cops credit for capturing him alive. It would've been easy to turn that boat into Swiss cheese.

[BillyB]

Although we see things differently on many issues, I like you too CG because you sincerely care about people and want this world to head in the right direction and when someone disagrees with you, you usually take the high road and keep things civil. Got to respect that. Now that we shared our feelings, anybody for a group hug?

[mendeleyev]

Good idea, Billy.

За здоровье!

[Shadow]

War in Afghanistan? If our government wants real benefits, they could've picked a more prosperous country to attack.

The benefits of controlling the Middle East drug production are quite big.

[Cameraguy]

Yes Shadow, control of the Afghani poppy fields were a bonanza for the CIA (Cocaine Import Agency), but the real goal was Caspian oil pipelines.

Here's a fascinating read, with scans of the original German documents: http://physics911.net/germanintel/

How's your Deutsch?

BACKGROUND REPORT ON 9/11/2001
TOP SECRET

On Monday 6, August, 2001, at 17:50, [German] Ambassador Ischinger personally notified the President of the United States that information developed by the Bundesamt fur Verfassungsschutz [German domestic secret service] as well as the BND [Bundesnachrichtendienst, German foreign secret service] indicated that an attack by a radical Arab group partially based in Germany was to occur on 10-11 September, 2001. The President was at that time in residence at his farm in Texas. Our [the German's] Ambassador was acting in direct response to instructions from Foreign Minister Fischer.

This information was developed from official surveillance of Arab extremist groups operating in the Federal Republic as well as from intercepted communications between the Embassy of Israel and the Israeli Foreign Ministry in Tel Aviv concerning this matter.

The information was “gratefully received” by the US President who stated at the time that he was also aware of the same pending assaults.

Subsequent to these attacks, the office of the US President, through the US Department of State, made an urgent request to the government of the Federal Republic of Germany that no reference whatsoever should be made to the official warnings given by Ambassador Ischinger.

In order to clarify the background of this matter, this Gesamtubersicht [overall survey] of the events leading to the assault was prepared, basing on extracts of reports from our [BND's] foreign stations. Overall, it is evident that the American authorities were aware of the pending attacks. Why they did nothing, is explained in the following:

[Shadow]

Yes Shadow, control of the Afghani poppy fields were a bonanza for the CIA (Cocaine Import Agency), but the real goal was Caspian oil pipelines.

Here's a fascinating read, with scans of the original German documents: http://physics911.net/germanintel/

How's your Deutsch?

Interesting document, and while I am wary of my grammar, my German is nearly up to level of my English, no problems reading.

[Daveman]

...

More noise. But here's real doozy for you...do you happen to know how many convicted prisoners that had been let go because of DNA evidences revealed they were in fact innocent?

http://www.innocenceproject.org/Content/Facts_on_PostConviction_DNA_Exonerations.php


...

"... In more than 25 percent of cases in a National Institute of Justice study, suspects were excluded once DNA testing was conducted during the criminal investigation (the study, conducted in 1995, included 10,060 cases where testing was performed by FBI labs).

The interesting point(s) for me so far...


-The suspect is a Naturalized Citizen.
-He is in custody but was intentionally NOT read or advised of his Miranda rights.
-He may be declared an Enemy Combatant in which case due process, guaranteed to every citizen by the Constitution, no longer applies.
-If declared an Enemy Combatant he may be kept in custody indefinitely without trial or even legal representation,  may be tortured interrogated - again indefinitely - for information (and/or confession of course)
-Could be subject to military tribunal or simply declared a terrorist and legally ordered to be executed by the President without any representation or legal process whatsoever.


God Bless the USSA...

[Shadow]

The interesting point(s) for me so far...


-The suspect is a Naturalized Citizen.
-He is in custody but was intentionally NOT read or advised of his Miranda rights.
-He may be declared an Enemy Combatant in which case due process, guaranteed to every citizen by the Constitution, no longer applies.
-If declared an Enemy Combatant he may be kept in custody indefinitely without trial or even legal representation,  may be tortured interrogated - again indefinitely - for information (and/or confession of course)
-Could be subject to military tribunal or simply declared a terrorist and legally ordered to be executed by the President without any representation or legal process whatsoever.


God Bless the USSA...

With 72 SWAT teams failing to shoot him, what else can you do? 

[BillyB]

What do you guys think about those people who lost the right to walk and the right to life? So what if the suspect is declared an enemy combatant and loses some rights. Life is not fair and should be like that for those that make a business of taking away the rights of others.

[Daveman]

What do you guys think about those people who lost the right to walk and the right to life? So what if the suspect is declared an enemy combatant and loses some rights. Life is not fair and should be like that for those that make a business of taking away the rights of others.

Did you not swear an oath to 'preserve, protect, and defend the Constitution of the United States of America'?



I think it is a tragedy that there are victims to a heinous crime and my heart goes out to those victims, their families, and the people of Boston.  Yet...


'What if' you ask?  The presumption of innocence and due process must remain paramount - even in cases where everyone is 'sure' of guilt. No gov't official in *any* capacity should have the authority to usurp the Constitution. Ever.  If they can do it to this citizen then they can do it to you, me, or anyone else.


You may trust the government to not abuse such power.  I do not.  The deluge begins with an innocent looking trickle.  The drafters of the Constitution/judicial system put forth monumental thought and effort to ensure we would never be *forced to trust in the 'integrity'* of government.

[GQBlues]

...I think it is a tragedy that there are victims to a heinous crime and my heart goes out to those victims, their families, and the people of Boston.  Yet...


'What if' you ask?  The presumption of innocence and due process must remain paramount - even in cases where everyone is 'sure' of guilt. No gov't official in *any* capacity should have the authority to usurp the Constitution. Ever.  If they can do it to this citizen then they can do it to you, me, or anyone else....

I agree with you DM. Any citizen of the US is equally protected under the Constitution. Normally when someone is arrested and didn't had the opportunity to have the arresting officers read that person's rights afforded to him/her by the Constitution, then the arrest by technicality is illegal.

In the age where an American citizen can be targeted and assassinated, I would suppose blatantly depriving one's right is benign. Hell, even Timothy McVeigh had a hearing and an appointed counsel. The 9/11 jihadists, after so much complaint / campaign of illegalities ultimately were granted 'hearings' - and they're not even US citizens.

There are a lot of things going on that for some strange reason that is not getting the press and attention. The Texas explosion alone had caused far more casualties and even up to now, folks are still dying and/or being found dead. The explosion literally leveled the surrounding township. But what is plastered all over the news screens?

Very strange time we're living in.

[mendeleyev]

The guys with the most interesting conspiracy theories are the Russians and the Israelis:

- The two could have been agents on the CIA payroll (could explain why the FBI let the elder go in 2010) with the mission to gather intelligence about Saudi links to training camps in Chechnya that were enabling Wahhabi jihadist networks to infiltrate Afghanistan and Iraq.

- According to the theories, the two are turned, then radicalized, instead ready to turn on their host country.

Interesting, not saying I'm a believer, but interesting.


I'm most curious about the Saudi in the hospital and why the Saudi foreign minister felt it important enough to have an emergency unscheduled meeting at the White House. Something on that stinks to high heaven and I'm not blaming the plumbers union. I don't think the kid was one of the bombers but wondering if there is a larger picture we're not seeing.

[BillyB]

Did you not swear an oath to 'preserve, protect, and defend the Constitution of the United States of America'?

Yes and what you're proposing in this situation is counter productive to upholding that oath.


The government didn't do anything illegal by not reading the suspect his Miranda Rights. There is an exemption for public safety. This suspect does not have the right to remain silent. We need to know if there are any other hidden bombs or collaborators creating bombs or funding their operation. Additional lives are at stake and their rights are important too. Yes?


The government also has the right to give the suspect, an American citizen, combatant status. He will still be tried in a civilian court.

No gov't official in *any* capacity should have the authority to usurp the Constitution. Ever.  If they can do it to this citizen then they can do it to you, me, or anyone else.

You're assuming our government broke the law and will continue to break the law in this case. I have not seen them break the law yet or usurp the Constitution.

[CanadaMan]

There are a lot of things going on that for some strange reason that is not getting the press and attention. The Texas explosion alone had caused far more casualties and even up to now, folks are still dying and/or being found dead. The explosion literally leveled the surrounding township. But what is plastered all over the news screens?

Very strange time we're living in.

I agree.
But a possible explanation might be that accidents simply aren't as 'sexy' as terrorism no matter the extent of devastation.

Let's face it, terrorism news sells big time!

But it must be homegrown terrorism.
Because any terrorism on foreign soil won't be given the coverage it gets here.

[lordtiberius]

More importantly..... Muslims.

GOB

Word to your mother

We don't know if this had anything to do with Islam, GOB.

I guess we kinda do.

Honestly, I have no faith in our ability to find culprits of bombings, murder, ect.

I don't have any faith either.

Or maybe just another example of self-radicalized young people.

Couldn't we just tell them to get a job?  oh wait . . .

Hard to know what to believe.

Second that emotion

even if they are not responsible for the bombing, they sure as hell are still criminals- hijacking a car, killing a campus police officer, robbing a 7-11 store, shooting it out with police with assault weapons, explosives.
 
Anybody here really believe that they are just victims?

I Blame it on Bush

Just looked at Djohar's VK page - he has several radical-looking Islamistic videos posted.

I told you Obama is a Muslim.

I realize most Bostonians have already given up their personal firearms but, what is wrong with this picture?

"People deserve the government they get, and they deserve to get it good and hard." HL Mencken

- The original detainee was Saudi.
- Quickly there was an unscheduled meeting of the Saudi foreign ambassador at the White House.
- The White House said that the detainee would be deported right away.
- The Saudi foreign ambassador said that the detainee came from an influential Saudi family.
- ICE then said that the detainee had already been scheduled for deportation.
- Then suddenly we shift attention to the two young men from Chechnya and the original detainee is dropped from news coverage.

Well, these two killed the 26 y.o. MIT police officer in his car, right after robbing the 7-11 (the 7-11 is directly across the Stata building on campus). And they were running on the MIT campus with bags full of amunition and explosives late at night!
 
The whole city lockdown seems excessive though

especially in light of the fact the cop was shot in the back of the head




his name was Sean Collier (26 yo)

With 72 SWAT teams failing to shoot him, what else can you do? 

If that is not a knee slapper, then start calling the Grand Canyon "Little Ditch."

Did you not swear an oath to 'preserve, protect, and defend the Constitution of the United States of America'?

You know who else swears that oath?  The greasy slime that become american citizens.


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oath_of_citizenship#United_States

I think it is a tragedy that there are victims to a heinous crime and my heart goes out to those victims, their families, and the people of Boston.

Here comes the but(t)

  Yet...

Weed's legal in COlorado right?

'What if' you ask?  The presumption of innocence and due process must remain paramount - even in cases where everyone is 'sure' of guilt. No gov't official in *any* capacity should have the authority to usurp the Constitution. Ever.  If they can do it to this citizen then they can do it to you, me, or anyone else.


You may trust the government to not abuse such power.  I do not.  The deluge begins with an innocent looking trickle.  The drafters of the Constitution/judicial system put forth monumental thought and effort to ensure we would never be *forced to trust in the 'integrity'* of government.

Birthers!  back in your cage   

Pitbull, I am glad the nightmare is somewhat over for you.  Mendy, GQ and Shadow, I agree. BillyB, you are like mayonnaise, when you spread it on everything and every where, it's nasty.

[BillyB]

a possible explanation might be that accidents simply aren't as 'sexy' as terrorism no matter the extent of devastation.

Accidents such as an explosion or plane going down killing people have a low chance of repeating itself and isn't necessary to show on tv over and over when loss of life is not likely to increase. On the other hand when there are armed killers on the loose that also blew off the limbs of dozens of people and continued to kill, that is going to be on the news until they are caught. Just the way it is.

[lordtiberius]

G. Rivera: "Tamerlan Tsarnev trained for 6 months in Chechnya"