Ukraine is losing the war

[lordtiberius]

Who is we?  Were you born in Ukraine?  Are you Ukrainian?  If so you can vote in their next election.

I am in Ukraine right now douche.

[Muzh]

I am in Ukraine right now douche.

Oooo, such language.

[Muzh]

I'm glad you're happy being around some of the smartest people in the world that believed Putin wouldn't invade Ukraine. You're right, I'm not in their class.

LMFAO


All I have is this mental image of them showing you the door.

[AC]

I am in Ukraine right now douching.

You say you're in Ukraine doing what?  You're there as a visitor.  Don't forget it.   

[JayH]

Are you serious?

100%-- I advised you of this a few months ago via another forum.
Actually--if you read AndrewFi in another place you will see him quoting his friend at life yesterday as being a source of accurate information!!
It was Phillips involved in proven staged scene of Russians having taken the airport on Saturday !!

[AC]

LMFAO


All I have is this mental image of them showing you the door.

I like that cartoon.  Sort of like the American voters showing the democrats the door in our recent election.  Similar to what's going to happen in the 2016 Presidential election to the democrats.

BTW is Susan Rice and Hillary Clinton on your silly little commitee?  I doubt if BB or anyone else with common sense about the issues facing Ukraine would want to be on that commitee.

When you get a commitee lead by an Ambasador with a brain and some backbone like John Bolton, let us know.

[JayH]

.

Back off. Support and encourage, but do not pressure.

Exactly as the man said!
It is a coalition-they have and are trying to do a huge amount to reform Ukraine and reflect the mandate of a new direction for the country--   a huge task at any time--let alone with having to deal with an invasio n and ongoing interference and terrorist attacks across Ukraine.
How long---years plus----- not 5 minutes.
Above all else--stability of government is crucial.

[AC]

Exactly as the man said!
It is a coalition-they have and are trying to do a huge amount to reform Ukraine and reflect the mandate of a new direction for the country--   a huge task at any time--let alone with having to deal with an invasio n and ongoing interference and terrorist attacks across Ukraine.
How long---years plus----- not 5 minutes.
Above all else--stability of government is crucial.

Good post.  Do you have any legitimate information that Ukraine is getting some of the weapons they need to defend themselves?

[AC]

The simple fact is that the US cannot maintain credibility elsewhere in the world in places it is much more needed than in Ukraine in dealing with Russia and her allies.  Leave the arming of Ukraine to some of the lesser contributors to NATO.   It is on their doorstep and they have the resources and the ability.  I would love to see a Leopard 2 take on a T-72.  Germany has more to gain and more to lose than any country other than Ukraine in this engagement from my point of view.

If I were Ukrainian I would be very nervous about the symbolism of German tanks on Ukrainian soil again.  Imagine what a field day the Russian propaganda machine would have with that.

Brass said that the British could probably take on the Russians by themselves.  Imagine a coalition of the British, the Poles and perhaps some Italians as well as obviously the Ukrainians.  A coalition approved by the United Nations, with a no fly zone enforced by NATO, but no US involvement.  It would be hard for Russia to put down such a coalition with their usual propaganda.

[lordtiberius]

I am among my family.  I have blood ties here.

Jon e, why should we allow Ukraine to be armed by "the lesser members of NATO"?  Why?  Is it because evil King Vlad has nukes?  We are the United States.  We must lead.  We must do something good.  We must resolve this problem whether we created it or not, we must finish.  We fought 2 world wars and a Cold War, we signed the Budapest Memorandum, does anyone seriously question our interest in the region?

If we do not reinforce the Ukrainian military and the Ukrainian economy, it will be a second Yalta.  You may not think you are influential because you hold no office.  But everyone here even the least among us is a foot soldier in the information war.

http://www.wsj.com/articles/john-vinocur-is-there-no-one-who-will-stand-up-for-ukraine-1421702240

[lordtiberius]

100%-- I advised you of this a few months ago via another forum.
Actually--if you read AndrewFi in another place you will see him quoting his friend at life yesterday as being a source of accurate information!!
It was Phillips involved in proven staged scene of Russians having taken the airport on Saturday !!

Dahm, birds of a feather. . .

[lordtiberius]

Exactly as the man said!
It is a coalition-they have and are trying to do a huge amount to reform Ukraine and reflect the mandate of a new direction for the country--   a huge task at any time--let alone with having to deal with an invasio n and ongoing interference and terrorist attacks across Ukraine.
How long---years plus----- not 5 minutes.
Above all else--stability of government is crucial.

Jay, you cannot be happy with the situation now.  It is someone's fault.  10% Poroshenko 90% the West

[mendeleyev]

LD, I have to call that a conspiracy story; smearing the local opposition is a regional sport. Kremlin controlled NTV did a "documentary" on him earlier this year, after which you'd think that he was Satan in the flesh. Not going to happen to a friend of Putin, even a "secret" pal.

[AC]

I am among my family.  I have blood ties here.

Jon e, why should we allow Ukraine to be armed by "the lesser members of NATO"?  Why?  Is it because evil King Vlad has nukes?  We are the United States.  We must lead.  We must do something good.  We must resolve this problem whether we created it or not, we must finish.  We fought 2 world wars and a Cold War, we signed the Budapest Memorandum, does anyone seriously question our interest in the region?

If we do not reinforce the Ukrainian military and the Ukrainian economy, it will be a second Yalta.  You may not think you are influential because you hold no office.  But everyone here even the least among us is a foot soldier in the information war.

http://www.wsj.com/articles/john-vinocur-is-there-no-one-who-will-stand-up-for-ukraine-1421702240

If the USA is directly involved in this situation it plays too easily into the narrative of Putin's propaganda machine that the US was behind Maidan and that the US helped to depose a democratically elected President (Yanukovych).

It would be better to have a coalition of Europeans with the US sitting it out.

[lordtiberius]

That's impossible.  We are already in it.  And who cares what that sh!t pot dick tater tells his people.  America stands for freedom.

Putin is nuclear blackmailing Obama and his western coterie of clowns.  I hate to say it but FT might be right.  Oil prices are about to go up again. 

[deccie]

If I were Ukrainian I would be very nervous about the symbolism of German tanks on Ukrainian soil again.  Imagine what a field day the Russian propaganda machine would have with that.

Brass said that the British could probably take on the Russians by themselves.  Imagine a coalition of the British, the Poles and perhaps some Italians as well as obviously the Ukrainians.  A coalition approved by the United Nations, with a no fly zone enforced by NATO, but no US involvement.  It would be hard for Russia to put down such a coalition with their usual propaganda.

The British forces have had severe cutbacks in recent years and cannot sustain any kind of extended action.  Even down to basics like tanks and spg's they have very limited numbers now. The Harrier is gone and the Tornado is going.

They also have no functional aircraft carrier. Even the support helicopter fleets have been cut and maritime surveillance no longer exists since the culling of the Nimrod.

[AC]

That's impossible.  We are already in it.  And who cares what that sh!t pot dick tater tells his people.  America stands for freedom.

Putin is nuclear blackmailing Obama and his western coterie of clowns.  I hate to say it but FT might be right.  Oil prices are about to go up again.

Okay let's do it.  Let's send some cargo planes filled with tanks and all the latest hardware and let's mobilize Fort Bragg, NC and send in the screaming eagles and whatever else we can throw at them.  At least one Aircraft carrier loaded to the brim with combat aircraft carrying the latest missiles and a few destroyers with some Tomahawk missiles. 

Now all we need is for Obama to sign off on this invasion force.   

[Muzh]

That's impossible.  We are already in it.  And who cares what that sh!t pot dick tater tells his people.  America stands for freedom.

Putin is nuclear blackmailing Obama and his western coterie of clowns.  I hate to say it but FT might be right.  Oil prices are about to go up again.

Step away from the keyboard and tend to your wife.

[AkMike]

Jay, you cannot be happy with the situation now.  It is someone's fault.  10% Poroshenko 90% the West

 Personally I'd say it's 100% the midgets fault. He supported the big thief Yanku and started the invasion after he fled the country.

[JayH]

 Personally I'd say it's 100% the midgets fault. He supported the big thief Yanku and started the invasion after he fled the country.

Agreed

[AC]

 Personally I'd say it's 100% the midgets fault. He supported the big thief Yanku and started the invasion after he fled the country.

Except for Doll and Belvis most of us agree 100% on that.   

[Chelseaboy]

Shadow doesn't agree..i don't think FT does either.

GQ certainly didn't before he went quiet...same with The Natural.

[AC]

Shadow doesn't agree..i don't think FT does either.

GQ certainly didn't before he went quiet...same with The Natural.

They are not Russian, so I guess I forgot about them.  People who are prone to believing conspiracy theories play right in to the Russians propaganda machine.

[lordtiberius]

AC is right.  Both parties agree Ukraine needs reinforcement but the President is the problem.  He is making moves in the Middle East that indicate to me he is giving into Nuclear blackmail.  John Schindler @20committee reports Russia has an Iran arms treaty.  Obama reversed itself with respect to Asaad and the Houthi, an Iranian proxy have seized the Yemeni capital.  Looks like FT will get his price increase in oil soon.

We are not helping Ukraine.  There isn't a whole lot Poroshenko can do that he hasn't already done.  Schlinder thinks Ukraine should mobilize a 1 million man army and follow the Croatian model.  Russia is not Serbia and when I pressed Schlinder for how exactly Ukraine would pay or supply this million man Army with a basic load of 210 rounds of ammunition, he insulted me.

If the Poroshenko government fails, it will be because of us or more precisely because of our President - the Nobel Peace Prize winner.

[fathertime]

.  Looks like FT will get his price increase in oil soon.

 

Oh come on now...I really don't want to see an increase, but I just don't think it will sink to the level you do.  You could wind up being right, especially if a large event occurs...but I'm hoping that steady hands will prevail throughout the world.


Fathertime!