Moscow trip report, I have returned.

[RussianWind]

saying she is going on a 2 week trip and then staying 6 months it is not breaking immigration laws "de Ure" but "de facto" she will more than likely not get tourist visa ever again.

Nope. She wouldn't break immigration laws doing this. She can stay as long as her visa allows her, otherwise they wouldn't issue her a length of 6-months.

[Jumper]

Question is how much? An interviewer's decision is very subjective. Time to time my friends and I browser Russian forums and people are still  denied visa despite all the requirements they have met. 

exactly
and i'm sure that applies to several forms of visas?

so my point was in her interview there may be both a set of given , and random questions ?
So she should understand what a K1 visa is issued for,
it is intended ,and the immigration visa law is written , as  solely for the purpose of marriage.
it is not a trail period.
i am not saying people shouldn't use it as such,or take full advantage of the 90 days allowed?


I am saying they should have a fundemental understanding of what any intervewing officer is looking at when
interviewing an applicant?
if he feels they are using it as a trail period,
 he could easily ,and rightfully,  turn them down .
It is not intended for a trial period and if things are still then ok we will marry. The law is not written to encompass that.
should it be? yes!!  is it? no.

so for judncc sake,
Lets be perfectly clear ,the visas intent is for an already engaged couple , fully planning to marry
to have time to make the WEDDING  arrangements.
(and those would be the correct answers right?)
The laws background /intent is from past times,and was originally penned over US military personal marrying foreigners,and creating a vehicle for that, but yes it is used in many other ways.
it is archaic ,certainly out of  date ,should be revised ,and is likely not often used per its true  intent. but it is how it is written.

Granted the interviewer might not ask,, he/she might not care ,
he/she might realize many people use it as a trial,,..
( i do not blame them? )
but why not be informed ,of the actual intent of the visa ,and at least be prepared at the interview?

 If it was my fiancee ,i'd want her to know about  the visa she is being interviewed for,and what its exact intended use is.
not go in there thinking differently, and giving answers that *could* jeopardize it's approval?
maybe i'm overly cautious and she could say anything and still get approved, i just wouldn't see the need to
take that chance , when its easy to go into the interview better informed.  

[KenC]

Ah yes......there have been many assumptions in the limited information revealed....and many jumping to conclusions of several sorts...
let's hear from Judncc again.....

Ulysses,
The only one "jumping to conclusions" here is judncc in accusing everyone of thinking badly of him and his woman.  The members here had only suggested areas of concern for him to think about without making any accusations.

Judncc has been welcomed to share his thinking on the different questions as some of the concerns posted by the members here have been in a form of a question.  This is a discussion board and well, members are going to discuss what has been posted.
KenC

[Jumper]

Nope. She wouldn't break immigration laws doing this. She can stay as long as her visa allows her, otherwise they wouldn't issue her a length of 6-months.

I would let william or muckraker (immigration attorneys) clear that up?

as i doubt either of us are on expert on USA tourist visa law

but for what it is worth- It is issued not as a 6 month stay , as a temporary resident?  
. it is issued as a *window of time* when you can  make the planned trip , or multiple trips.
to come and go during that time frame, not reside in the country the entirety of it..

my ukrainian(and many other countries ) tourist visas have been  similar ,
their  intent was not to stay 6 months(or one year) , but to be able to travel during that 6 months.(or one year)

Techincally , yes you could stay the 6 months!!(or one year)  sure!

but yes if you do it raises eyebrows. and yes you can be hassled by both immigration officers at points of departure /entry
and on future applications.

RW,  you've used a *tourist visa* in such a way?

I have.  While no *dire* consequences,  there were some of the troubles mentioned..

[OlgaH]

he/she might realize many people use it as a trial,,..
( i do not blame them? )

Or she/he exactly knows why 90 days are given - to make a final decision - especially to a woman  . Because to be exposed to his natural life, home, family and etc is much different from his several visits, and a woman can see things about him that she could not see before.  

[Jumper]

Or she/he exactly knows why 90 days are given - to make a final decision - especially to a woman   . Because to be exposed to his natural life, home, family and etc is much different from his several visits, and a woman can see things about him that she could not see before.  

ok..
but tell that to the ,many denied K1 visa applicants.


again i am not saying to not ultilize the 90 days in this way,
 i'm saying when giving someone the advice to go into the interview with that mindset,.,
that you are counting on the consulate officer interpreting the visa law as you would "like" it to be.. not as it is written.. ..
does robert agree with you in this advice? 
 to advise a couple to use the 90  days,, wisely,,  seems logical?

to advise them that the interviewing officer (he/she)   wink wink knows *why* you are viewing the  90 days a
 trial period , doesn't.

no need at all to take that risk.
Enter the interview with full intent to marry and use the 90 days ,to arrange your marriage.

then what you do with the 90 days, after the visa is issued,  is up to you.

why leave the approval of it , up to the officers interpretation of the 90 days?
because they are supposed to be interpreting it as written.


sorry olga , 99.9% of the time i fully agree with you..

but in this case i find it a silly risk risk to approach the interviewing officer with the  "hope" 
(hee /she) intereprets the K1 visas intent differently than it is written,
 simply because it is often used differently once issued.

but iv'e beat this dead horse enough..LOL
 

[OlgaH]

ok..
but tell that to the ,many denied K1 visa applicants.

How many people do you know who were denied K1 visa because when they were asked "Are you going to marry" they answered "Yes, but we have 90 days to make a final decision"?

[RussianWind]

as i doubt either of us are on expert on USA tourist visa law

True. But at least one of us is with a big travel and visa application experience.

 

[Jumper]

How many people do you know who were denied K1 visa because when they were asked "Are you going to marry" they answered "Yes, but we have 90 days to make a final decision"?

that met  once for 4 days???
research it?
 i dont need to?  as i'm the one advising to be prepared and answer according to the K1;s guidelines and intent.


if it is 1,000, or if it just one denied ?
what difference?
is it worth judncc risk?  


The point is WHY take the risk?

Why not answer:

We are in love and ARE getting married, we realize we only have 90 days to prepare for the nuptials and ceremony..
and are already making arrangements so that we will be married within that time frame.



the K1 visa is to marry ! not to decide if you still want to after you see him, his house,his country, his cat,
so the advise to answer ,
 *yes, we plan to marry (umm it's a K1 visa you have to  at last answer yes)
but we have 90 days to make the decision*


is simply bad advise.

it is  not terribly unlike telling a tourist visa  applicant to answer,
 
yes i'm just going as a tourist  for two weeks,
but since i have two weeks and i may use a few days to look for  a job
 
the additional info is not needed , or wanted , and could harm the chances for the visa approval.

[OlgaH]

that met  once for 4 days???

If they will be denied they will be denied because of the lack of evidence of their relationship.

BTW there is information about advantages of K-1 on some Russian websites and US websites that give consultation about Visa K-1
http://www.visaservice.com/k1_vs_k3.shtml

[Jumper]

True. But at least one of us is with a big travel and visa application experience.

 

yes,  my experience of misusing a tourist visa,as temporary resident visa /work visa ,
 is VERY limited!!   to just one country,Brazil.
(and what a headache it was)

The other handful of countries i've lived and worked in , I  kept the visas  in order.
(well Ukraine really screwed up a point of entry on my visa once ,and that was a boat load of problems,,but it was
their mistake ,not mine)
 

I have yet to screw up , or misuse a US tourist visa, but know plenty that have..   

i've also known plenty of people that used the 90 days of a K1 visa as a trail period, (why not?)
but none were foolish enough to tell the consulate officer that it was their intent to do so.. ...

[OlgaH]

i've also known plenty of people that used the 90 days of a K1 visa as a trail period, (why not?)
but none were foolish enough to tell the consulate officer that it was their intent to do so.. ...

I'm talking exactly about the same thing that there is no need to tell the consulate officer you are going to use 90 days as a trial. 

[KenC]

Olga & AJ,
I have changed my mind slightly on the whole one week wonder thing.  Having coined the phrase, that is a huge shift in positions too.

Times HAVE changed.  With Skype, video talks and the new found ease of communication two people may be able to form a close personal bond with limited face to face time.  I am not even totally against "using" the K-1 process a bit to finalise the eventual decision to follow through on a marriage as long as both parties are cool with it.  I only question if 90 days is long enough to really "know" the other person well enough to enter into marriage.

Maybe Olga or some of the other women here can give us some input on exactly how their 90 day window transpired.  Were you so overwhelmed by your new country and culture that you were not plainly thinking about your relationship with your future husband?  Or was having your future husband by your side while going through the transformation helpful in understanding each other?  Did you feel that 90 days was enough?  Or did you just take a chance? :noidea:
KenC

[OlgaH]

Ken, honestly I did not experienced any difficult time when I came to U.S. and when Robert and I applied for visa K-1 we both were sure about our decision. I did not had any problems during my interview. A consulate officer looked through our documents and evidence and asked me just three questions "How do you met each other?" - my answer was "Through the Internet". "Do you speak English" - "Yes, I do, but I need more practice" , "Where is Robert right now?" - "Waiting outside the embassy"  She asked me in Russian and I answered in English
 
But I have read the stories by women and personally met two women in Russia who were disappointed by what they saw in reality when they came to U.S. by visa K-1.   

[OlgaH]

 I am not even totally against "using" the K-1 process a bit to finalise the eventual decision to follow through on a marriage as long as both parties are cool with it.  I only question if 90 days is long enough to really "know" the other person well enough to enter into marriage.

KenC

Yes, the decision to use 90 days as a trial should be mutual and both should be responsible.
Of course 90 days is not enough but at least it is something.   

[Gylden]

IMO it is ridiculous to just plain poorly done, that there is no other way for a woman to come to the US to visit her BF or fiancee before making the move. It can be such a shock for women who have never been to the US much less a foreign country to take this on with such a commitment, without ever experiencing at least a little.
I wouldn't have though about marrying my wife without her first hand knowledge of my everyday life and the different environment in her prospective new home.
Someone needs to wake up!!
 

[KenC]

Ken, honestly I did not experienced any difficult time when I came to U.S. and when Robert and I applied for visa K-1 we both were sure about our decision. I did not had any problems during my interview. A consulate officer looked through our documents and evidence and asked me just three questions "How do you met each other?" - my answer was "Through the Internet". "Do you speak English" - "Yes, I do, but I need more practice" , "Where is Robert right now?" - "Waiting outside the embassy"  She asked me in Russian and I answered in English
 
But I have read the stories by women and personally met two women in Russia who were disappointed by what they saw in reality when they came to U.S. by visa K-1.   

Olga,
You KNOW I think you and Robert are the PERFECT match for each other, so do not think I ever question that!  But I would like to know how long you two had known each other prior to the K-1 for example.
KenC

[OlgaH]

Olga,
You KNOW I think you and Robert are the PERFECT match for each other, so do not think I ever question that!  But I would like to know how long you two had known each other prior to the K-1 for example.
KenC

Ken, though we both, Robert and I, feel as a good match we have our arguments time to time and we even had I would say "bloody" arguments   because we both are individuals and have our own views that can be different    But I think all that arguments and problem resolving just shows how much we love each other and we are not indifferent to each other. I think it is just normal to have the arguments, otherwise it would be too boring 

If I remember we found each other at the end of September and decided to spend about two weeks together in December (two Christmases and New Year) and after we started our K-1 process.      

[KenC]

Olga,
So you two communicated for 3 months, spent 2 weeks face to face and then filed the K-1?  Was there any visits in between filing for the K-1 and you coming to America?  How long did it take?

Any relationship seeks it's own level of controversy IMO.  Some couples enjoy a verbal debate while others do not.  It is only "bad" when the couple is mismatched in this area.
KenC

[Turboguy]

So our best advice to the OP is for him to be sure to tell her to lie during the interview.

[Jumper]

So our best advice to the OP is for him to be sure to tell her to lie during the interview.

sadly yes..

 

[OlgaH]

Olga,
So you two communicated for 3 months, spent 2 weeks face to face and then filed the K-1?  Was there any visits in between filing for the K-1 and you coming to America?  How long did it take?

Any relationship seeks it's own level of controversy IMO.  Some couples enjoy a verbal debate while others do not.  It is only "bad" when the couple is mismatched in this area.
KenC

No, Ken, there was not any visits between. Before we met face to face and during our K-1 process we actually lived together by the use of the phone  

Timing for K-1 visa was: Our meeting was December 2005-January 2006, the petition was received by USCIS in March 2006 and  was approved in May 2006, my interview was in August 18, 2006 and Robert and I arrived in U.S. together in August 30, 2006.

I would not say that we enjoyed a verbal debate too much but sometime we just need let off steam, make the point, come to consensus with kissing and hugging    

[OlgaH]

So our best advice to the OP is for him to be sure to tell her to lie during the interview.

Lie?  No he must be sure that she can proof their relationship as I wrote in OP's other thread. How it will be easy for them I don't know. I don't think she will be even asked such question. I think the government gave 90 days for purpose - to give people some time not to make a mistake.

About true lie - with all the visa law Russian mafia doesn't have any problems with visa to U.S. and living in U.S.   
 

[OlgaH]

sadly yes..

 

Sadly is when a guy brings his woman in US, helps her with all the documents, education and job and she says him "Adieu!" after the removal of the conditions. 

[Faux Pas]

Timing for K-1 visa was: Our meeting was December 2005-January 2006, the petition was received by USCIS in March 2006 and  was approved in May 2006, my interview was in August 18, 2006 and Robert and I arrived in U.S. together in August 30, 2006.

  

So you enjoyed 2 weeks together first meeting in Dec 05-Jan 2006, then Robert returned for your interview for the 2nd time, how long was he with you in Russia for that interview trip before you both returned to the US?